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marinepenguin

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Date Signed Up:1/24/2011
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latest user's comments

#164 - That's, like, all false. All of it.  [+] (8 replies) 07/23/2016 on "why are people mad and... +38
User avatar
#180 - useroftheLOLZ (07/23/2016) [-]
>Training with sidearm
I have a seven year old Beretta 92fs, police buy back. When I bought it, it was in pristine condition. It needed zero work, the finishing in the slide rails was pristine as well and the Barrel's rifling was brand. Fucking. New. All it shows of is holster wear.

>Non lethal detainment and improper restraint detainment
policelink.monster.com/training/articles/2271-a-lack-of-in-service-training-may-lead-to-liability
Here you go boyo

Oh and this is quite funny as well
scholarworks.law.ubalt.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1810&context=lf

Cops literally being trained to use batons improperly, to use killing strikes in order to "detain" someone

>In the moment training
Is literally biological. When your body enters fight or flight mode, blood is drawn to your core while adrenaline is poured into your limbs. This results in the loss of sensation in your hands and fingers, which contributes to the "Itchy trigger finger" dilemma that caused the cop to shot the dude on the ground. He literally didn't know why he pulled the trigger, because he was afraid and wasn't properly trained to deal with heat and was DEFINITELY improperly trained with his sidearm because his finger should have been on the trigger in the first damn place.

The military teaches you how to deal with this by spending hours at the range, doing drills in all sorts of situations.

>Dealing with retards
Its all over the news fuckboi.

And how do I know most of this? Because I work with 4 different guys, all going through the police academy who've all said the same thing consistently, their training is in serious need of reform because there are things that they are not being taught. Once is almost finished and told me yesterday when we were talking about this shit, he's graduating in 4 months and none of his instructors have talked about restraining someone outside of when they're moving around, with their hands behind their back.

He's literally got to take a course from another company who actually does suplimental police training because there are things he doesn't know, but is seriously afraid he'll fuck up on because it wasn't taught to him well enough to get a firm understanding. Things like safe grapples, how to measure less than lethal force, more in depth training on the usage of tasers, and a shit ton more training with his Glock because while he's familiar with it, he was a noguns before becoming a cop and has put less than 300 rounds down range.
User avatar
#235 - marinepenguin (07/23/2016) [-]
>Training with sidearm
I'm a military cop and we work with civilian cops constantly. Every police department and academy is different, so it's hard to point out one specific group and say "all police operate at this level of standards", it depends on their manning, budgets, leadership, community and numerous other variables. We compare training, train together, and just bullshit together so we know each others rules and capabilities fairly well. Personally I was issued a brand new sidearm and within the couple months I've had it I've fired it a few hundred times and the police I've worked with fire at the range at least twice a month when they've got extra ammunition. These weapons are also expertly maintained and even after years of use they're still perfectly functioning regardless of outside wear and tear.

>Non lethal detainment and improper restraint detainment
Personally we train with police every other Wednesday and cuffing/detainment/apprehension procedures are the backbone basics that we touch on every time. Never had any incidents on a base with 39,000 people and in an area with over a million.

>Oh and this is quite funny as well
That was literally the exact opposite of how I was trained and how I've been trained to use a baton, and again, we train in conjunction with local police forces.


>In the moment training
We have a "video game" that is a simulation of thousands of various scenarios that change upon your response to the specific situation. We PT beforehand, then strap a tazer to our belt, while going through these scenarios. If we do something wrong, break the law, misuse Force, or get shot, we get 10k volts to the ass. That game is the closest thing you can get to training within a real life situation, outside of an actual event.

>Dealing with retards
I already gave you that one, I have received absolutely zero training on special needs individual. I also don't trust television news networks on any sort of topic.

"And how do I know most of this? Because I work with 4 different guys, all going through the police academy who've all said the same thing consistently, their training is in serious need of reform because there are things that they are not being taught. Once is almost finished and told me yesterday when we were talking about this shit, he's graduating in 4 months and none of his instructors have talked about restraining someone outside of when they're moving around, with their hands behind their back.

He's literally got to take a course from another company who actually does suplimental police training because there are things he doesn't know, but is seriously afraid he'll fuck up on because it wasn't taught to him well enough to get a firm understanding. Things like safe grapples, how to measure less than lethal force, more in depth training on the usage of tasers, and a shit ton more training with his Glock because while he's familiar with it, he was a noguns before becoming a cop and has put less than 300 rounds down range."

That's your personal experience just as I've shared mine. That academy and it's appalling departments do seem like they need some serious work in terms of training and administration. It would be interesting to know the area and how much of an issue crime and other statistics may be effected if the training is truly that under par.

But that description does not follow with my own personal experiences or the experiences of Amy police officer I've ever had the conversation with.
User avatar
#297 - useroftheLOLZ (07/23/2016) [-]
If it's hard to point out the discrepancies between the level of standard among police academies, then the standards need to be seriously reformed. The fact that there's half a dozen different ways to become a cop, creating half a dozen different types of quality is a clear sign something is wrong and we've become to lax. It shouldn't come down to issues of manning, budgets and leadership, not when the Police are expected to keep civil order.

Not when we've got incidents like what happened in Orlando where because the police who arrived at the shooting were complete and utter idiots and decided to get into a firefight with the shooter, the FBI must now conduct an investigation to see if there were any casualties that were tied to Police misconduct, because any idiot can tell that the numbers don't add up considering the time frame, number of shots he took inside and outside of the club and what the Corner has discovered with certain bodies having been pumped full of lead.

And working with guns over the years as well as getting engineering schooling, I can tell when a machine has been well maintained and when it's barely, if ever, used. You look at places that sell police buyback firearms and its the same story, everywhere. "Like new, never used, shows holster wear, never fired, dropped once." It's fucking appalling, especially when this guy was supposedly SWAT, was aiming for the stationary Tard and ended up shooting the Wrangler 5 feet away from him. Police should be extensively trained in ACADEMY, not when they get out. The amount of time spent teaching cops to draw while wearing a retention holster shouldn't be greater than that spent teaching them to keep their booger picker off the fucking trigger.

And a couple hundred times over the course of a couple months isn't good enough. I've been putting 250-400 rounds of 9mm through my Beretta on my monthly trip to the range. Shooting is a skill that you either use or lose. The fact that we've got cops coming out of the academy being tested in a 80 shot test that's easier to pass than half of the country's CCW's testing requirements, is a serious issue.

And referencing your previous point on budgets, manpower and the like, if your servicing an area of around a million, then wouldn't you expect that your department would have better training.

And here, were was the oversight? Why wasn't someone reporting up the chain, "Hey, we're being trained to kill people with less than lethal tactics through improper training and arming."?

And in this, not every department can afford something like this, but the military has honed it down to an art and is able to teach the bare basics in 3 months flat, to about a hundred thousand people a year, and has been doing it since the 1950's when the United State's bootcamp training doctrine started taking the steps to refine it's training process into an art. I'd much rather see a slower process of training taking place. Not one where you get a 2 year degree, go to academy for 4 months, get slapped on the ass and thrown into duty. One where police never really stop getting renewal training I find far more preferential. If we have Teachers getting renewal schooling, why not cops? Something more than just requalification.

Your experience is different than mine obviously, considering you work in a densely populated area.

Mine is in Wisconsin and of the guys I know who are going through accademy, one is doing it in southern Wisconsin, two are doing Northern, and one is going towards the East, near the bigger cities. Hell, I worked a guy who worked in the Milwaukee Sheriff's department for 10 years, one of the worst cities in the state and he gave the same sort of response, that during his time, many guys were not ready.

There needs to be a reform that standardizes training, in addition to an increase in the quality of training.
#198 - anon (07/23/2016) [-]
Now I only skimmed the 2nd article, but from what I can tell it is talking about a specific place, not a universal mistraining of police officers. All it does is start off by detailing the many ways it is illegal to mistrain then it says "hey they are doing this in Baltimore."
#206 - anon (07/23/2016) [-]
An opinion. Albeit one by someone qualified to make theirs known, but an opinion nonetheless. I don't doubt there is a need for reform in the training method. But I do doubt to an extreme level that the current training method is wrong. I expect the current training method works just fine purely as a method to train police officers but is unable to withstand all the extra requirements put into police these days.
User avatar
#217 - useroftheLOLZ (07/23/2016) [-]
We have a man who knows the system better than 99.999% of the population saying there needs to be a serious reform, but that's an opinion?

So when Interpol tells the world, "Hey, don't start letting immigrant Muslims into the West, willy nilly because that's inviting ISIS into the front door, handing them a loaded gun and saying, 'well I'm going to go take a deep nap on the couch, my daughters are upstairs in their unlocked rooms, have fun stranger"?

I talk to people who are going through the system RIGHT NOW, every day. They've all said the same thing, that they feel extremely unprepared for what they're expected to do.

If we have shit like this going on, with Cops and Police top Brass saying the system is inadequate, then stop playing retard and start listening. There is no extra requirements and I have no idea what the issue you're taking is.

Cops don't need more or extra training to be more effective?

Cops aren't prepared because that sure as shit is fucking wrong.

That the fucking Police are wrong and you're right despite them saying that things are not how they should be?
#208 - anon (07/23/2016) [-]
Which is to say the current training method is fine, but there is always a better one.
#122804 - That's not an argument  [+] (3 replies) 07/23/2016 on Politics - politics news,... 0
User avatar
#122827 - redandgreen (07/24/2016) [-]
Nor was your statement.

We've been over this before though.....
Freedom of speech predates the US.
Other nations have freedom of speech in their constitution.
The press is not particularly free in the US when compared to other democratic nations.
User avatar
#122843 - marinepenguin (07/24/2016) [-]

"We've been over this before though..... "
>We have a couple times, and we've never come to agreement on most things
"Freedom of speech predates the US."
>This was one thing we did agree with when discussing the idea of "American Exceptionalism", which I think mainly is a misunderstanding of what that term actually means.

"Other nations have freedom of speech in their constitution. "
>I also agree, Britain especially has had free speech law for a long time, but these are very clearly being violated to suppress events and ideas in Europe.

"The press is not particularly free in the US when compared to other democratic nations."
>I would have agreed with this even a couple months ago, but the press in the US isn't denied reporting what they please. There is a huge monopoly on press in the US that serves to push certain narratives, and there is an attempt to drown out all smaller media outlets that fight these narratives. But I've never heard of a media outlet being told "you can't post that article, or run that story" by the government.
User avatar
#123080 - redandgreen (07/27/2016) [-]
Free speech is being violated everywhere due to fear of terrorism etc. including by the Patriot Act in the US.

As we discussed before, this isn't the first time for the US, HUAC is another.

The press in the US is not as free as that in many other nations:

www.freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-press-2014/press-freedom-rankings

rsf.org/en/news/united-states-ranks-41st-reporters-without-borders-2016-world-press-freedom-index
#122590 - That's not a violation of free speech, that's a violation of t…  [+] (2 replies) 07/22/2016 on Politics - politics news,... 0
User avatar
#122598 - whoozy (07/22/2016) [-]
When punishments become to cruel it can make people afraid to act within their rights
On paper this isnt' a free speech issue, but if this was where I lived I'd never post any form of morbid humour anywhere
User avatar
#122629 - marinepenguin (07/22/2016) [-]
I still would.
#122585 - Then that isn't a free speech problem, it's an issue with that…  [+] (4 replies) 07/22/2016 on Politics - politics news,... 0
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#122587 - whoozy (07/22/2016) [-]
It could be considered a free speech problem
If I could get 8 years in prison for saying something that could be considered a threat (like really crude humour or an angry post) I would probably be a lot more afraid of voicing my opinions.

If you slip up you loose a decade of your life. A DECADE for a Facebook post.
User avatar
#122590 - marinepenguin (07/22/2016) [-]
That's not a violation of free speech, that's a violation of the 8th Amendment (cruel and unusual punishment). If the person is being punished for saying their opinion, that's a violation of the 1st. If they are being punished excessively or too severely for something that is actually illegal, that's a violation of the 8th.

The kid did do something illegal, but anyone knowing the totality of circumstances should have realized that 5 months in prison was excessive.

So again, problem with this situation? Yes

Was it free speech? Not one bit.
User avatar
#122598 - whoozy (07/22/2016) [-]
When punishments become to cruel it can make people afraid to act within their rights
On paper this isnt' a free speech issue, but if this was where I lived I'd never post any form of morbid humour anywhere
User avatar
#122629 - marinepenguin (07/22/2016) [-]
I still would.
#122583 - Threats and calls to action are not protected under free speec…  [+] (6 replies) 07/22/2016 on Politics - politics news,... 0
User avatar
#122584 - whoozy (07/22/2016) [-]
I know it's illegal
That wasn't the issue

The issue is the ridiculous sentence

User avatar
#122585 - marinepenguin (07/22/2016) [-]
Then that isn't a free speech problem, it's an issue with that areas justice system.
User avatar
#122587 - whoozy (07/22/2016) [-]
It could be considered a free speech problem
If I could get 8 years in prison for saying something that could be considered a threat (like really crude humour or an angry post) I would probably be a lot more afraid of voicing my opinions.

If you slip up you loose a decade of your life. A DECADE for a Facebook post.
User avatar
#122590 - marinepenguin (07/22/2016) [-]
That's not a violation of free speech, that's a violation of the 8th Amendment (cruel and unusual punishment). If the person is being punished for saying their opinion, that's a violation of the 1st. If they are being punished excessively or too severely for something that is actually illegal, that's a violation of the 8th.

The kid did do something illegal, but anyone knowing the totality of circumstances should have realized that 5 months in prison was excessive.

So again, problem with this situation? Yes

Was it free speech? Not one bit.
User avatar
#122598 - whoozy (07/22/2016) [-]
When punishments become to cruel it can make people afraid to act within their rights
On paper this isnt' a free speech issue, but if this was where I lived I'd never post any form of morbid humour anywhere
User avatar
#122629 - marinepenguin (07/22/2016) [-]
I still would.