jokeface

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Gender: male
Age: 24
Consoles Owned: Nintendo DS, PS2
Video Games Played: Pokemon, Pokemon, and that one with the monsters you have to capture and battle. I forget what it's called.
Interests: Writing, Lucid dreaming, Pokemon, Transformers (yes, even the Michael Bay version), Christianity, and movies.
Date Signed Up:4/07/2011
Last Login:2/01/2015
Location:Right behind you
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I tell jokes and I make faces. I am JokeFace.

latest user's comments

#53866 - Well what do you expect me to do? I'm perfectly content with m…  [+] (4 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
User avatar #53868 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
I'm not mad, and I'm not trying to force you. I'm just saying that judging by avaluable evidence about reality your god can't exist.
And I don't expect you to change your views because I don't like them.
But still, faith is a bad reason.
It's irrational to accept something blindly without evidence, or contrary to facts.
#53900 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
Of course you will see it as irrational because that is what comes to your mind when you can't prove something. Believing in something doesn't mean you have to see it. We humans won't be able to see who God truly is and so as a result people will just use that as a basis to claim his nonexistence
User avatar #53902 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
I wan't using that we can't see god as an argument, shit, we can't even see ultraviolet on our own.
I was saying that the god jokeface defined can't exist in this reality, by definition.
And you still haven't lived up one bit to your claim that you have any evidence.
Why not provide that evidence, and log in.
User avatar #53869 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
The way I see it, faith has no adverse effect on life so long as it doesn't impact your ability to function successfully within the world. And my faith doesn't inhibit me from living a happy, healthy lifestyle. I still enjoy learning from science and whatnot, I just think it's wrong about some of the details about our origin story. But I accept and embrace all the progress it has made in terms of engineering, medicine, and so forth. So please understand that having faith in God does not have to prevent a person from still being leading a rational life.
#53864 - Picture  [+] (3 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board +2
User avatar #53875 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
I made my gif, wana see it?
User avatar #53876 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Sure.
#53877 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
How do you like it?
#53862 - Even the Bible addresses the fact that other religions existed…  [+] (25 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
User avatar #53873 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
You missed the point. The point is that your judaic god was not apart of human history despite what your bible claims according to all of the available archaeological evidence until about 1000 years after language began writing down religion.

Considering gods have not yet been demonstrated, it is far more probable that the judaic accounts are as fabricated as all of your pagan gods.
User avatar #53874 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Yes, it's extremely probable. That odds against our faith are staggering. But that's irrelevant, because we don't base our faith on odds. Nor on archaeology, for that matter. If we did, then no one would deny evolution, old earth theory, etc. But we believe that history can lie, just as easily as religious texts can lie. I've said this before, if you were a supernatural entity who chose to use your powers to collapse man's faith in God, wouldn't your first move be to fabricate a bunch of evidence to falsely discredit Him? I mean, that's what I would do.
User avatar #53910 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
"Yes, it's extremely probable. That odds against our faith are staggering."

Umm what? odds staggering = extremely probable?

"But that's irrelevant, because we don't base our faith on odds. "

You don't base your faith on anything really...that is why its faith. I suppose you could say you base it on hope, but hope doesn't prove anything now does it?

"Nor on archaeology, for that matter. If we did, then no one would deny evolution, old earth theory, etc"

Kind of the point. Right here you are basically admitting that you are being willfully blind/ignorant. You acknowledge that reality suggests otherwise, but you continue to have faith anyway. For what reasons? I'd assume personal comfort and the promise of a reward in face of a threatening eternal punishment.

" But we believe that history can lie, just as easily as religious texts can lie."

Well you see, that's what makes history so great. Because it doesn't all come from a single biased source most of the time. Because of this, we're able to sort out the liars and don't accept it.

"I've said this before, if you were a supernatural entity who chose to use your powers to collapse man's faith in God, wouldn't your first move be to fabricate a bunch of evidence to falsely discredit Him?"

What? Is this a new, deeper form of delusion? Now it's christian conspiracy theories? And is this really your basis for continuing to have faith?

This assumes the supernatural is real. This assumes deities are real. This assumes that a deity has ill intentions against another. This assumes that evidence is planted to the contrary. This assumes that intelligent deities would think as mortal men would.

And ultimately, even if you were right and some evil deity was purposely misleading the majority of mankind, your loving God is still a dick for allowing it to happen. And he's a even a bigger dick for continuing to punish man for things out of their control. He was already a dick for giving infinite punishments for finite crimes.
User avatar #53920 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I'm not going to address all of those individually, because I'm really just focused on the last one right now. Believing in an evil deity who exists just to counter everything God does is not a "Christian conspiracy theory", it's one of the largest aspects of the entire religion. Satan was an angel who rebelled against god and was cast out of heaven, and his entire modus operandi is tempting and deceiving people in order to lead them away from God. I didn't come up with this stuff, its been a fixed part of the canon from the beginning. And no, this isn't the basis for my faith, because I would still have faith even if Satan was out of the picture. But that factor is why I'm skeptical about evolution and old earth theory.
User avatar #53923 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
"its been a fixed part of the canon from the beginning. "

Still a conspiracy theory. But the way you stated it was somewhat new.

"And no, this isn't the basis for my faith, because I would still have faith even if Satan was out of the picture. But that factor is why I'm skeptical about evolution and old earth theory. "

You're skeptical about evolution and old earth? Oh my. I'm sorry but this is a wild tangent you have now gone on. It should not be a factor at all, you still haven't been able to demonstrate the first claim that a God exists.

This is no different than Sandy Hook Conspiratards saying it was really the CIA that killed all those kids but all the evidence was covered up and more was planted to accuse Adam Lanza.
User avatar #53981 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I have no intention of demonstrating God's existence, as it is not mine to demonstrate. And I don't understand why you (meaning all atheists) keep making that same demand for evidence when you all know what the answer is going to be. The reason I left this board for so long was because the conversations were getting repetitive and stale. And you're one of the more prominent regulars here. I would hope you'd be more progressive in your discussions.
User avatar #53990 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
"I have no intention of demonstrating God's existence, as it is not mine to demonstrate. And I don't understand why you (meaning all atheists) keep making that same demand for evidence when you all know what the answer is going to be"

You have no intentions of proving that what you believe is true? How selfish of you. It IS your duty to demonstrate it, because you actively believe it. You support it. And you do so without any good reason which makes you dishonest. You make a special case for religion, a case that you don't apply to other beliefs that have the same amount of anecdotal evidence. And on top of this, you have the audacity to even think that followers of other religions have been misled and that those religions are false (even though they offer the same amount of evidence as your own).

The reason we stress evidence is because of the importance of believing things for good reasons. Our beliefs influence our actions and because of this, it's mutually beneficial for everyone to hold beliefs that are most adherent to reality. Your beliefs do not reflect reality.

Lets make a hypothetical and say that your religion is actually true 100%. You still currently have no reason to accept those claims and you are dishonest if you do. Belief should be held when the evidence supports it and not a moment sooner. And any God that rewards willful ignorance and punishes healthy skepticism is an immoral God that does not deserve worship.

"The reason I left this board for so long was because the conversations were getting repetitive and stale. And you're one of the more prominent regulars here. I would hope you'd be more progressive in your discussions. "

Explain to me how to be progressive? Our arguments remain the same because your religion remains the same. We are the ones open to change, while it seems you are not. You want to talk about repetitive and stale, then take a good long look at your Bible and the arguments in support of it.
User avatar #53993 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
And what about all the other things people believe in without proof? Should I never date again, and give up on m goal of one day being married? Because those things are based on trust and loyalty. They might cheat on me, and be so good at it that I never find out. Am I then dishonest for trusting them?
User avatar #54000 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
Know your battles. Belief and hope are separate things. I personally hope there is an afterlife so that I can see my family and what not. It's a nice thought, but that is where it ends for me.

Secondly, some things are okay to believe with just anecdotal evidence. If somebody told me that as a child they nearly drowned to death, I am perfectly okay with accepting that without proof. The claim is not extraordinary. We know it is a common occurrence, especially with children. It is a completely reasonable claim and ultimately matters little if it happens to not be true.
But comparing that to the very nature of our existence, to how we are suppose to live our life, and to what happens at the end of life is a different matter entirely.

"They might cheat on me, and be so good at it that I never find out. Am I then dishonest for trusting them? "

It depends on if they are trustworthy. If you have never caught her in a lie(cheating) or at least never in anything serious, you then have no reason to suspect that she might be a liar(cheater) and therefore it is perfectly reasonable to assume she isn't cheating. If she turns out as a cheater, it's unfortunate and kick her to the curb.

The point is, if she didn't give you a reason to doubt, then don't doubt. If she didn't give you a reason to distrust, then don't distrust.

If she is good at keeping it a secret from you, so good that you never suspect her, then you are doing exactly what a rational person is supposed to be doing; not believing without reason. You are being honest in this situation.

But if this same situation applied and you get some wild, paranoid thought that she is cheating without having a good reason for thinking it, and then you confront her and accuse her of cheating, you are being dishonest. Even if she was indeed cheating, the fact that you accused her without having a rational reason would make you dishonest.
User avatar #54016 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I think you interpreted my analogy backwards. I meant it like this:

God exists = my wife is faithful and I'm right in trusting her
God doesn't exist = my wife is cheating on me but I don't know it, so I trust her anyway
User avatar #54092 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
No, I think you didn't understand my point to begin with, which is why you felt the need to create some analogy in the first place.

"God exists = my wife is faithful and I'm right in trusting her
God doesn't exist = my wife is cheating on me but I don't know it, so I trust her anyway"

I must be honest, I have no clue what you are trying to explain with this analogy. It certainly doesn't reflect the point I was trying to make. I have no idea how the existence or nonexistence of a God is equivalent to a faithful or cheating wife and your ability to trust her.

Maybe you should start again with my original point and work from there.
User avatar #54093 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
All right, fair enough. Please reiterate it, as it's your point.
User avatar #54094 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
My point is that a person should withhold belief until they have a good reason in order to stay honest.
User avatar #53911 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Why do you speak about ''deities'' and ''ill intentions''?
User avatar #53913 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
This is religion board and I am replying to a comment in support of deities that have ill intentions?
User avatar #53914 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Which ''deities'' have ill intentions according to you?
User avatar #53915 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
None, I was not the claimant. I am the person challenging the silly notion.
User avatar #53916 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Oh. srry tl;dr most of this thread. I was gonna go on about the reason this world is as fucked as it is and not many get assistance from a higher being. The deity known as God is watching the humanity he created tear itself apart in wars and corruption all over the world, but there's a specific reason for it.
User avatar #53917 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
It seems like everyone has their own theory about it all, I wonder which theory is right if any of them at all. And how would someone know which was right? And why believe until you do?
User avatar #53918 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Eh. Well, my theory is basic. God controls a court of higher beings known as the angels, archangels, and other deities that reign the heavens with him, and watch over us. We, were the first, on his appearance, but not the first of his creations, and he watched as how his traitorous arch angel rebelled on earth and made his creations turn against him. God had two options. Destroy us instantly, or let us continue, and see if what the arch angel said was going to be fulfilled. His words were : I will make every being on this earth forget that you exist. And so, God granted him a certain ammount of time for him to do this. He did this because if he just destroyed us he would be seen as an evil, cowardly God who never gave his subjects a chance. Though he knew of the consequences that letting us roam free in a world controlled by an evil deity, he still gave us the chance, to prove to all of his servants that: He's right, he's magnanimous and benevolent, and of course, if this were to happen again, to destroy his next creations on an instant.
User avatar #53984 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I like that theory, but it's got some holes. You say He had the option to "see if what the archangel said was going to be fulfilled." The problem with that is that God is omniscient. He doesn't need to "see if" anything will happen because He already knows. The second problem is that you said He didn't want to be seen as cowardly. If God cared even the slightest about what we thought of Him, then I'm sure he'd use a course of action that didn't result in so many people calling him evil and cruel and all that negative shit.
User avatar #53921 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
Right. But you skipped the portion that gives you reason to suggest a God exists. And then somehow formulated this theory, but I don't know where from. It's the equivalent of me writing a story and then believing in it.
User avatar #53922 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Bible. Read about the war of the heavens in which his second son Lucifer rebelled against him. And I know God exists because Lucifer's minions roam earth and can be contacted by the right persons.
#53925 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
Lucifer is not in the bible
User avatar #53924 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
So The Bible is true because The Bible says so?
Yes, mostly anyone familiar with Christian teachings know about the war, but you have taken this basic idea, expanded upon it and thrown a bit of politics and reasoning for God and the devil, which is why it is your theory. I am asking how you came to any of this information. To quote my crazy grandmother "If The Bible doesn't say it, it isn't true." (speaking to me as a young child when I noticed some of the flaws and tried to make sense of them by reasoning)

If you know, enlighten us. Please once and for all end the disagreements between atheists and Christians(and other religions) and demonstrate it.

#53861 - Well then reality must be relative, because all that means is …  [+] (10 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board +1
User avatar #53863 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
So what you're saying is: Oh, if by the consequences of the definition of reality and that wat we know to apply to it he can't be true, instead of correcting your own view you are saying that the definition of reality should be canged?
That 's a poor excuse.

Also: The phrase: "He's just too abstract to understand" is the intelectual equivalent of shouting "ohh, look over there" and running away.
You can't just CLAIM that he's to abstract, that has no value whatsoever in an argument.
You need to prove your claims, or they can be disregarded as bullshit.
"That wich is postulated without evidence can be dissmissed without evidence."
#53897 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
Obviously God is not going to be in accordance with modern physics because he is above everything. By using science facts and quotes by humans to back up your claims is a bad argument because God is not bound by what we humans understand him to be, we will never be able to understand God so obviously he is going to go against science or that quote you used
User avatar #53899 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
That's still not a fact, that's a baseless claim, without facts backing it up.
#53895 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
there are many facts to back up the claim that God is too abstract to understand.
User avatar #53896 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
Name them.
User avatar #53866 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well what do you expect me to do? I'm perfectly content with my beliefs without proof, and that's entirely what faith is. You can't just demand that I try to formulate an argument based on your own standards and then get mad at me when you don't like my answer. I'm not trying to bullshit my belief into complying with your views. I just have my views in spite of yours.
User avatar #53868 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
I'm not mad, and I'm not trying to force you. I'm just saying that judging by avaluable evidence about reality your god can't exist.
And I don't expect you to change your views because I don't like them.
But still, faith is a bad reason.
It's irrational to accept something blindly without evidence, or contrary to facts.
#53900 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
Of course you will see it as irrational because that is what comes to your mind when you can't prove something. Believing in something doesn't mean you have to see it. We humans won't be able to see who God truly is and so as a result people will just use that as a basis to claim his nonexistence
User avatar #53902 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
I wan't using that we can't see god as an argument, shit, we can't even see ultraviolet on our own.
I was saying that the god jokeface defined can't exist in this reality, by definition.
And you still haven't lived up one bit to your claim that you have any evidence.
Why not provide that evidence, and log in.
User avatar #53869 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
The way I see it, faith has no adverse effect on life so long as it doesn't impact your ability to function successfully within the world. And my faith doesn't inhibit me from living a happy, healthy lifestyle. I still enjoy learning from science and whatnot, I just think it's wrong about some of the details about our origin story. But I accept and embrace all the progress it has made in terms of engineering, medicine, and so forth. So please understand that having faith in God does not have to prevent a person from still being leading a rational life.
#53857 - Hmmm. I'm growing increasingly tempted.  [+] (5 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
User avatar #53859 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Wonder what is for breakfast?
#53864 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
User avatar #53875 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
I made my gif, wana see it?
User avatar #53876 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Sure.
#53877 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
How do you like it?
#53853 - I'd have to learn more about him. What other policies does he have?  [+] (7 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
#53854 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Putin for lunch and dinner.
User avatar #53857 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Hmmm. I'm growing increasingly tempted.
User avatar #53859 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Wonder what is for breakfast?
#53864 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
User avatar #53875 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
I made my gif, wana see it?
User avatar #53876 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Sure.
#53877 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
How do you like it?
#53851 - Well, I do agree with his stance on Sharia Law. So he gets poi…  [+] (9 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board +1
User avatar #53852 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
<3
Are you ready to conver to Putinism?

Well you gota being somewhere.
User avatar #53853 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I'd have to learn more about him. What other policies does he have?
#53854 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Putin for lunch and dinner.
User avatar #53857 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Hmmm. I'm growing increasingly tempted.
User avatar #53859 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Wonder what is for breakfast?
#53864 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
User avatar #53875 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
I made my gif, wana see it?
User avatar #53876 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Sure.
#53877 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
How do you like it?
#53849 - I don't understand, I'm sorry. I mean I think I kinda get what…  [+] (15 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
User avatar #53850 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Putin is love
Putin is life
User avatar #53858 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
And that's not his dog.
I always thought his dog was black.
User avatar #53860 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
k
User avatar #53867 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
top doge
User avatar #53851 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well, I do agree with his stance on Sharia Law. So he gets points for that.
User avatar #53852 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
<3
Are you ready to conver to Putinism?

Well you gota being somewhere.
User avatar #53853 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I'd have to learn more about him. What other policies does he have?
#53854 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Putin for lunch and dinner.
User avatar #53857 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Hmmm. I'm growing increasingly tempted.
User avatar #53859 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Wonder what is for breakfast?
#53864 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
User avatar #53875 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
I made my gif, wana see it?
User avatar #53876 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Sure.
#53877 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
How do you like it?
#53845 - If He existed eternally, then what makes you think He's bound …  [+] (12 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board +1
User avatar #53856 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
what, you think he exists in the bulk?
Have you any faintest idea of particle physics?
Also: The other 6 dimenions are "rolled up", or structured, in such a way that strings can only wrap arround them, but not exist between several of these dimensions.
Also: IF. The concept I'm basing my views on, is supported by incredible amounts of evidence. Is yours based on any evidence at all?
Also: "Dimensions" is not just a loose term you can just throw arround.
And yes, he has to be bound by physical laws, since these "laws" are just how we express what reality is and how everything exists.
So yes, it could be that the 'laws' of physics don't apply to him/it.
But that would mean that he isn't part of reality, and therefore not real.
User avatar #53861 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well then reality must be relative, because all that means is that He's not real in accordance with our definition of what is real. But He can certainly exist regardless of that. He's just too abstract to comprehend.
User avatar #53863 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
So what you're saying is: Oh, if by the consequences of the definition of reality and that wat we know to apply to it he can't be true, instead of correcting your own view you are saying that the definition of reality should be canged?
That 's a poor excuse.

Also: The phrase: "He's just too abstract to understand" is the intelectual equivalent of shouting "ohh, look over there" and running away.
You can't just CLAIM that he's to abstract, that has no value whatsoever in an argument.
You need to prove your claims, or they can be disregarded as bullshit.
"That wich is postulated without evidence can be dissmissed without evidence."
#53897 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
Obviously God is not going to be in accordance with modern physics because he is above everything. By using science facts and quotes by humans to back up your claims is a bad argument because God is not bound by what we humans understand him to be, we will never be able to understand God so obviously he is going to go against science or that quote you used
User avatar #53899 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
That's still not a fact, that's a baseless claim, without facts backing it up.
#53895 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
there are many facts to back up the claim that God is too abstract to understand.
User avatar #53896 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
Name them.
User avatar #53866 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well what do you expect me to do? I'm perfectly content with my beliefs without proof, and that's entirely what faith is. You can't just demand that I try to formulate an argument based on your own standards and then get mad at me when you don't like my answer. I'm not trying to bullshit my belief into complying with your views. I just have my views in spite of yours.
User avatar #53868 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
I'm not mad, and I'm not trying to force you. I'm just saying that judging by avaluable evidence about reality your god can't exist.
And I don't expect you to change your views because I don't like them.
But still, faith is a bad reason.
It's irrational to accept something blindly without evidence, or contrary to facts.
#53900 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
Of course you will see it as irrational because that is what comes to your mind when you can't prove something. Believing in something doesn't mean you have to see it. We humans won't be able to see who God truly is and so as a result people will just use that as a basis to claim his nonexistence
User avatar #53902 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
I wan't using that we can't see god as an argument, shit, we can't even see ultraviolet on our own.
I was saying that the god jokeface defined can't exist in this reality, by definition.
And you still haven't lived up one bit to your claim that you have any evidence.
Why not provide that evidence, and log in.
User avatar #53869 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
The way I see it, faith has no adverse effect on life so long as it doesn't impact your ability to function successfully within the world. And my faith doesn't inhibit me from living a happy, healthy lifestyle. I still enjoy learning from science and whatnot, I just think it's wrong about some of the details about our origin story. But I accept and embrace all the progress it has made in terms of engineering, medicine, and so forth. So please understand that having faith in God does not have to prevent a person from still being leading a rational life.
#53840 - He didn't "begin". He always was. And furthermore, p…  [+] (20 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
User avatar #53847 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Holy shit my first OC GIF on FJ : D
#53844 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
User avatar #53849 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I don't understand, I'm sorry. I mean I think I kinda get what the graphic means, but the Putin throws me off completely.
User avatar #53850 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Putin is love
Putin is life
User avatar #53858 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
And that's not his dog.
I always thought his dog was black.
User avatar #53860 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
k
User avatar #53867 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
top doge
User avatar #53851 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well, I do agree with his stance on Sharia Law. So he gets points for that.
User avatar #53852 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
<3
Are you ready to conver to Putinism?

Well you gota being somewhere.
User avatar #53853 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I'd have to learn more about him. What other policies does he have?
#53854 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Putin for lunch and dinner.
User avatar #53857 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Hmmm. I'm growing increasingly tempted.
User avatar #53859 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Wonder what is for breakfast?
#53864 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
User avatar #53875 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
I made my gif, wana see it?
User avatar #53876 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Sure.
#53877 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
How do you like it?
User avatar #53843 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
gif wont work wait
#53842 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
#53837 - I'm not talking about when the religions were historically fou…  [+] (58 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
User avatar #53855 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
This brings up a problem with the continuity of your religion. You see, you have a period of about a thousand years after the oldest known religion was being practiced where the Judeo Christian God is not mentioned anywhere in the world according to current findings. But you have several other religions shown being practiced during this period, many of which are drastically different.

My point being is that mankind would have started out knowing about God according to the biblical record and the archeology should reflect this. It doesn't. There is a period of non-existance and then suddenly, poof, it shows up well after other beliefs have been long established.
User avatar #53862 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Even the Bible addresses the fact that other religions existed before Judaism. They're called Pagan religions, and the OT is chock full of them. That's why God is often referred to as "the God of Abraham" or "the God of Jacob" etc, instead of just "God". Because if they just called Him God, then nobody would know which God they were referring to. And those Pagan religions came about the same way you think Judaism and Christianity came about. By people just trying to fill in the gaps of what they didn't understand.
User avatar #53873 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
You missed the point. The point is that your judaic god was not apart of human history despite what your bible claims according to all of the available archaeological evidence until about 1000 years after language began writing down religion.

Considering gods have not yet been demonstrated, it is far more probable that the judaic accounts are as fabricated as all of your pagan gods.
User avatar #53874 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Yes, it's extremely probable. That odds against our faith are staggering. But that's irrelevant, because we don't base our faith on odds. Nor on archaeology, for that matter. If we did, then no one would deny evolution, old earth theory, etc. But we believe that history can lie, just as easily as religious texts can lie. I've said this before, if you were a supernatural entity who chose to use your powers to collapse man's faith in God, wouldn't your first move be to fabricate a bunch of evidence to falsely discredit Him? I mean, that's what I would do.
User avatar #53910 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
"Yes, it's extremely probable. That odds against our faith are staggering."

Umm what? odds staggering = extremely probable?

"But that's irrelevant, because we don't base our faith on odds. "

You don't base your faith on anything really...that is why its faith. I suppose you could say you base it on hope, but hope doesn't prove anything now does it?

"Nor on archaeology, for that matter. If we did, then no one would deny evolution, old earth theory, etc"

Kind of the point. Right here you are basically admitting that you are being willfully blind/ignorant. You acknowledge that reality suggests otherwise, but you continue to have faith anyway. For what reasons? I'd assume personal comfort and the promise of a reward in face of a threatening eternal punishment.

" But we believe that history can lie, just as easily as religious texts can lie."

Well you see, that's what makes history so great. Because it doesn't all come from a single biased source most of the time. Because of this, we're able to sort out the liars and don't accept it.

"I've said this before, if you were a supernatural entity who chose to use your powers to collapse man's faith in God, wouldn't your first move be to fabricate a bunch of evidence to falsely discredit Him?"

What? Is this a new, deeper form of delusion? Now it's christian conspiracy theories? And is this really your basis for continuing to have faith?

This assumes the supernatural is real. This assumes deities are real. This assumes that a deity has ill intentions against another. This assumes that evidence is planted to the contrary. This assumes that intelligent deities would think as mortal men would.

And ultimately, even if you were right and some evil deity was purposely misleading the majority of mankind, your loving God is still a dick for allowing it to happen. And he's a even a bigger dick for continuing to punish man for things out of their control. He was already a dick for giving infinite punishments for finite crimes.
User avatar #53920 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I'm not going to address all of those individually, because I'm really just focused on the last one right now. Believing in an evil deity who exists just to counter everything God does is not a "Christian conspiracy theory", it's one of the largest aspects of the entire religion. Satan was an angel who rebelled against god and was cast out of heaven, and his entire modus operandi is tempting and deceiving people in order to lead them away from God. I didn't come up with this stuff, its been a fixed part of the canon from the beginning. And no, this isn't the basis for my faith, because I would still have faith even if Satan was out of the picture. But that factor is why I'm skeptical about evolution and old earth theory.
User avatar #53923 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
"its been a fixed part of the canon from the beginning. "

Still a conspiracy theory. But the way you stated it was somewhat new.

"And no, this isn't the basis for my faith, because I would still have faith even if Satan was out of the picture. But that factor is why I'm skeptical about evolution and old earth theory. "

You're skeptical about evolution and old earth? Oh my. I'm sorry but this is a wild tangent you have now gone on. It should not be a factor at all, you still haven't been able to demonstrate the first claim that a God exists.

This is no different than Sandy Hook Conspiratards saying it was really the CIA that killed all those kids but all the evidence was covered up and more was planted to accuse Adam Lanza.
User avatar #53981 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I have no intention of demonstrating God's existence, as it is not mine to demonstrate. And I don't understand why you (meaning all atheists) keep making that same demand for evidence when you all know what the answer is going to be. The reason I left this board for so long was because the conversations were getting repetitive and stale. And you're one of the more prominent regulars here. I would hope you'd be more progressive in your discussions.
User avatar #53990 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
"I have no intention of demonstrating God's existence, as it is not mine to demonstrate. And I don't understand why you (meaning all atheists) keep making that same demand for evidence when you all know what the answer is going to be"

You have no intentions of proving that what you believe is true? How selfish of you. It IS your duty to demonstrate it, because you actively believe it. You support it. And you do so without any good reason which makes you dishonest. You make a special case for religion, a case that you don't apply to other beliefs that have the same amount of anecdotal evidence. And on top of this, you have the audacity to even think that followers of other religions have been misled and that those religions are false (even though they offer the same amount of evidence as your own).

The reason we stress evidence is because of the importance of believing things for good reasons. Our beliefs influence our actions and because of this, it's mutually beneficial for everyone to hold beliefs that are most adherent to reality. Your beliefs do not reflect reality.

Lets make a hypothetical and say that your religion is actually true 100%. You still currently have no reason to accept those claims and you are dishonest if you do. Belief should be held when the evidence supports it and not a moment sooner. And any God that rewards willful ignorance and punishes healthy skepticism is an immoral God that does not deserve worship.

"The reason I left this board for so long was because the conversations were getting repetitive and stale. And you're one of the more prominent regulars here. I would hope you'd be more progressive in your discussions. "

Explain to me how to be progressive? Our arguments remain the same because your religion remains the same. We are the ones open to change, while it seems you are not. You want to talk about repetitive and stale, then take a good long look at your Bible and the arguments in support of it.
User avatar #53993 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
And what about all the other things people believe in without proof? Should I never date again, and give up on m goal of one day being married? Because those things are based on trust and loyalty. They might cheat on me, and be so good at it that I never find out. Am I then dishonest for trusting them?
User avatar #54000 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
Know your battles. Belief and hope are separate things. I personally hope there is an afterlife so that I can see my family and what not. It's a nice thought, but that is where it ends for me.

Secondly, some things are okay to believe with just anecdotal evidence. If somebody told me that as a child they nearly drowned to death, I am perfectly okay with accepting that without proof. The claim is not extraordinary. We know it is a common occurrence, especially with children. It is a completely reasonable claim and ultimately matters little if it happens to not be true.
But comparing that to the very nature of our existence, to how we are suppose to live our life, and to what happens at the end of life is a different matter entirely.

"They might cheat on me, and be so good at it that I never find out. Am I then dishonest for trusting them? "

It depends on if they are trustworthy. If you have never caught her in a lie(cheating) or at least never in anything serious, you then have no reason to suspect that she might be a liar(cheater) and therefore it is perfectly reasonable to assume she isn't cheating. If she turns out as a cheater, it's unfortunate and kick her to the curb.

The point is, if she didn't give you a reason to doubt, then don't doubt. If she didn't give you a reason to distrust, then don't distrust.

If she is good at keeping it a secret from you, so good that you never suspect her, then you are doing exactly what a rational person is supposed to be doing; not believing without reason. You are being honest in this situation.

But if this same situation applied and you get some wild, paranoid thought that she is cheating without having a good reason for thinking it, and then you confront her and accuse her of cheating, you are being dishonest. Even if she was indeed cheating, the fact that you accused her without having a rational reason would make you dishonest.
User avatar #54016 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I think you interpreted my analogy backwards. I meant it like this:

God exists = my wife is faithful and I'm right in trusting her
God doesn't exist = my wife is cheating on me but I don't know it, so I trust her anyway
User avatar #54092 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
No, I think you didn't understand my point to begin with, which is why you felt the need to create some analogy in the first place.

"God exists = my wife is faithful and I'm right in trusting her
God doesn't exist = my wife is cheating on me but I don't know it, so I trust her anyway"

I must be honest, I have no clue what you are trying to explain with this analogy. It certainly doesn't reflect the point I was trying to make. I have no idea how the existence or nonexistence of a God is equivalent to a faithful or cheating wife and your ability to trust her.

Maybe you should start again with my original point and work from there.
User avatar #54093 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
All right, fair enough. Please reiterate it, as it's your point.
User avatar #54094 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
My point is that a person should withhold belief until they have a good reason in order to stay honest.
User avatar #53911 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Why do you speak about ''deities'' and ''ill intentions''?
User avatar #53913 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
This is religion board and I am replying to a comment in support of deities that have ill intentions?
User avatar #53914 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Which ''deities'' have ill intentions according to you?
User avatar #53915 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
None, I was not the claimant. I am the person challenging the silly notion.
User avatar #53916 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Oh. srry tl;dr most of this thread. I was gonna go on about the reason this world is as fucked as it is and not many get assistance from a higher being. The deity known as God is watching the humanity he created tear itself apart in wars and corruption all over the world, but there's a specific reason for it.
User avatar #53917 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
It seems like everyone has their own theory about it all, I wonder which theory is right if any of them at all. And how would someone know which was right? And why believe until you do?
User avatar #53918 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Eh. Well, my theory is basic. God controls a court of higher beings known as the angels, archangels, and other deities that reign the heavens with him, and watch over us. We, were the first, on his appearance, but not the first of his creations, and he watched as how his traitorous arch angel rebelled on earth and made his creations turn against him. God had two options. Destroy us instantly, or let us continue, and see if what the arch angel said was going to be fulfilled. His words were : I will make every being on this earth forget that you exist. And so, God granted him a certain ammount of time for him to do this. He did this because if he just destroyed us he would be seen as an evil, cowardly God who never gave his subjects a chance. Though he knew of the consequences that letting us roam free in a world controlled by an evil deity, he still gave us the chance, to prove to all of his servants that: He's right, he's magnanimous and benevolent, and of course, if this were to happen again, to destroy his next creations on an instant.
User avatar #53984 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I like that theory, but it's got some holes. You say He had the option to "see if what the archangel said was going to be fulfilled." The problem with that is that God is omniscient. He doesn't need to "see if" anything will happen because He already knows. The second problem is that you said He didn't want to be seen as cowardly. If God cared even the slightest about what we thought of Him, then I'm sure he'd use a course of action that didn't result in so many people calling him evil and cruel and all that negative shit.
User avatar #53921 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
Right. But you skipped the portion that gives you reason to suggest a God exists. And then somehow formulated this theory, but I don't know where from. It's the equivalent of me writing a story and then believing in it.
User avatar #53922 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Bible. Read about the war of the heavens in which his second son Lucifer rebelled against him. And I know God exists because Lucifer's minions roam earth and can be contacted by the right persons.
#53925 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
Lucifer is not in the bible
User avatar #53924 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
So The Bible is true because The Bible says so?
Yes, mostly anyone familiar with Christian teachings know about the war, but you have taken this basic idea, expanded upon it and thrown a bit of politics and reasoning for God and the devil, which is why it is your theory. I am asking how you came to any of this information. To quote my crazy grandmother "If The Bible doesn't say it, it isn't true." (speaking to me as a young child when I noticed some of the flaws and tried to make sense of them by reasoning)

If you know, enlighten us. Please once and for all end the disagreements between atheists and Christians(and other religions) and demonstrate it.

User avatar #53838 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Where did God begin?
User avatar #53878 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Thread ran out.

I like it, but the text appears kind of slowly. I'd try to speed that part up if you can. Other than that it looks awesome
User avatar #53879 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
thanks man
User avatar #53880 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
No prob.
#53881 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Like this?
User avatar #53884 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Hmm it looks about the same to me.
User avatar #53886 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
its faster by 2fps/second
User avatar #53888 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Ohh. Well I just meant the words being made from the bullet holes, I feel like it takes a long time for them to appear.
User avatar #53890 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
it's a pistol and it's not that fast.......
User avatar #53891 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Haha, fair enough.
User avatar #53840 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
He didn't "begin". He always was. And furthermore, part of being omnipresent means He exists everywhere.
User avatar #53847 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Holy shit my first OC GIF on FJ : D
#53844 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
User avatar #53849 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I don't understand, I'm sorry. I mean I think I kinda get what the graphic means, but the Putin throws me off completely.
User avatar #53850 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Putin is love
Putin is life
User avatar #53858 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
And that's not his dog.
I always thought his dog was black.
User avatar #53860 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
k
User avatar #53867 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
top doge
User avatar #53851 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well, I do agree with his stance on Sharia Law. So he gets points for that.
User avatar #53852 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
<3
Are you ready to conver to Putinism?

Well you gota being somewhere.
User avatar #53853 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I'd have to learn more about him. What other policies does he have?
#53854 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Putin for lunch and dinner.
User avatar #53857 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Hmmm. I'm growing increasingly tempted.
User avatar #53859 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Wonder what is for breakfast?
#53864 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
User avatar #53875 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
I made my gif, wana see it?
User avatar #53876 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Sure.
#53877 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
How do you like it?
User avatar #53843 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
gif wont work wait
#53842 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
#53834 - I think, considering that the Judeo-Christian God is omniprese…  [+] (74 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
User avatar #53839 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
If I may ask one thing: So your god is falsifyable? Since if he is omnipresent, wich itself would violate countless physical laws, he must be part of our reality, and our 4-bran spacetime, wich means necessarily that he is falsifyable.
User avatar #53845 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
If He existed eternally, then what makes you think He's bound by the physical laws of our dimensions? Our universe has been proven to be finite, yes? So if He exists, and is indeed eternal, then He must exist outside our 4-dimensional plane of existence.
User avatar #53856 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
what, you think he exists in the bulk?
Have you any faintest idea of particle physics?
Also: The other 6 dimenions are "rolled up", or structured, in such a way that strings can only wrap arround them, but not exist between several of these dimensions.
Also: IF. The concept I'm basing my views on, is supported by incredible amounts of evidence. Is yours based on any evidence at all?
Also: "Dimensions" is not just a loose term you can just throw arround.
And yes, he has to be bound by physical laws, since these "laws" are just how we express what reality is and how everything exists.
So yes, it could be that the 'laws' of physics don't apply to him/it.
But that would mean that he isn't part of reality, and therefore not real.
User avatar #53861 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well then reality must be relative, because all that means is that He's not real in accordance with our definition of what is real. But He can certainly exist regardless of that. He's just too abstract to comprehend.
User avatar #53863 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
So what you're saying is: Oh, if by the consequences of the definition of reality and that wat we know to apply to it he can't be true, instead of correcting your own view you are saying that the definition of reality should be canged?
That 's a poor excuse.

Also: The phrase: "He's just too abstract to understand" is the intelectual equivalent of shouting "ohh, look over there" and running away.
You can't just CLAIM that he's to abstract, that has no value whatsoever in an argument.
You need to prove your claims, or they can be disregarded as bullshit.
"That wich is postulated without evidence can be dissmissed without evidence."
#53897 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
Obviously God is not going to be in accordance with modern physics because he is above everything. By using science facts and quotes by humans to back up your claims is a bad argument because God is not bound by what we humans understand him to be, we will never be able to understand God so obviously he is going to go against science or that quote you used
User avatar #53899 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
That's still not a fact, that's a baseless claim, without facts backing it up.
#53895 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
there are many facts to back up the claim that God is too abstract to understand.
User avatar #53896 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
Name them.
User avatar #53866 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well what do you expect me to do? I'm perfectly content with my beliefs without proof, and that's entirely what faith is. You can't just demand that I try to formulate an argument based on your own standards and then get mad at me when you don't like my answer. I'm not trying to bullshit my belief into complying with your views. I just have my views in spite of yours.
User avatar #53868 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
I'm not mad, and I'm not trying to force you. I'm just saying that judging by avaluable evidence about reality your god can't exist.
And I don't expect you to change your views because I don't like them.
But still, faith is a bad reason.
It's irrational to accept something blindly without evidence, or contrary to facts.
#53900 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
Of course you will see it as irrational because that is what comes to your mind when you can't prove something. Believing in something doesn't mean you have to see it. We humans won't be able to see who God truly is and so as a result people will just use that as a basis to claim his nonexistence
User avatar #53902 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
I wan't using that we can't see god as an argument, shit, we can't even see ultraviolet on our own.
I was saying that the god jokeface defined can't exist in this reality, by definition.
And you still haven't lived up one bit to your claim that you have any evidence.
Why not provide that evidence, and log in.
User avatar #53869 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
The way I see it, faith has no adverse effect on life so long as it doesn't impact your ability to function successfully within the world. And my faith doesn't inhibit me from living a happy, healthy lifestyle. I still enjoy learning from science and whatnot, I just think it's wrong about some of the details about our origin story. But I accept and embrace all the progress it has made in terms of engineering, medicine, and so forth. So please understand that having faith in God does not have to prevent a person from still being leading a rational life.
User avatar #53836 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
>Illyrian faith founded 4th century BC
>Christ was born 2000 yaers ago
check yo dates
User avatar #53837 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I'm not talking about when the religions were historically founded. I'm talking about the ages of the gods within the context of their respective religions. If Judaism and Christianity are correct, then God always existed. As for the "old gods", I don't know which gods you're referring to, but whichever ones they are, I doubt they can top eternal existence. Tie, maybe, if they are eternal too, but that's it.
User avatar #53855 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
This brings up a problem with the continuity of your religion. You see, you have a period of about a thousand years after the oldest known religion was being practiced where the Judeo Christian God is not mentioned anywhere in the world according to current findings. But you have several other religions shown being practiced during this period, many of which are drastically different.

My point being is that mankind would have started out knowing about God according to the biblical record and the archeology should reflect this. It doesn't. There is a period of non-existance and then suddenly, poof, it shows up well after other beliefs have been long established.
User avatar #53862 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Even the Bible addresses the fact that other religions existed before Judaism. They're called Pagan religions, and the OT is chock full of them. That's why God is often referred to as "the God of Abraham" or "the God of Jacob" etc, instead of just "God". Because if they just called Him God, then nobody would know which God they were referring to. And those Pagan religions came about the same way you think Judaism and Christianity came about. By people just trying to fill in the gaps of what they didn't understand.
User avatar #53873 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
You missed the point. The point is that your judaic god was not apart of human history despite what your bible claims according to all of the available archaeological evidence until about 1000 years after language began writing down religion.

Considering gods have not yet been demonstrated, it is far more probable that the judaic accounts are as fabricated as all of your pagan gods.
User avatar #53874 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Yes, it's extremely probable. That odds against our faith are staggering. But that's irrelevant, because we don't base our faith on odds. Nor on archaeology, for that matter. If we did, then no one would deny evolution, old earth theory, etc. But we believe that history can lie, just as easily as religious texts can lie. I've said this before, if you were a supernatural entity who chose to use your powers to collapse man's faith in God, wouldn't your first move be to fabricate a bunch of evidence to falsely discredit Him? I mean, that's what I would do.
User avatar #53910 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
"Yes, it's extremely probable. That odds against our faith are staggering."

Umm what? odds staggering = extremely probable?

"But that's irrelevant, because we don't base our faith on odds. "

You don't base your faith on anything really...that is why its faith. I suppose you could say you base it on hope, but hope doesn't prove anything now does it?

"Nor on archaeology, for that matter. If we did, then no one would deny evolution, old earth theory, etc"

Kind of the point. Right here you are basically admitting that you are being willfully blind/ignorant. You acknowledge that reality suggests otherwise, but you continue to have faith anyway. For what reasons? I'd assume personal comfort and the promise of a reward in face of a threatening eternal punishment.

" But we believe that history can lie, just as easily as religious texts can lie."

Well you see, that's what makes history so great. Because it doesn't all come from a single biased source most of the time. Because of this, we're able to sort out the liars and don't accept it.

"I've said this before, if you were a supernatural entity who chose to use your powers to collapse man's faith in God, wouldn't your first move be to fabricate a bunch of evidence to falsely discredit Him?"

What? Is this a new, deeper form of delusion? Now it's christian conspiracy theories? And is this really your basis for continuing to have faith?

This assumes the supernatural is real. This assumes deities are real. This assumes that a deity has ill intentions against another. This assumes that evidence is planted to the contrary. This assumes that intelligent deities would think as mortal men would.

And ultimately, even if you were right and some evil deity was purposely misleading the majority of mankind, your loving God is still a dick for allowing it to happen. And he's a even a bigger dick for continuing to punish man for things out of their control. He was already a dick for giving infinite punishments for finite crimes.
User avatar #53920 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I'm not going to address all of those individually, because I'm really just focused on the last one right now. Believing in an evil deity who exists just to counter everything God does is not a "Christian conspiracy theory", it's one of the largest aspects of the entire religion. Satan was an angel who rebelled against god and was cast out of heaven, and his entire modus operandi is tempting and deceiving people in order to lead them away from God. I didn't come up with this stuff, its been a fixed part of the canon from the beginning. And no, this isn't the basis for my faith, because I would still have faith even if Satan was out of the picture. But that factor is why I'm skeptical about evolution and old earth theory.
User avatar #53923 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
"its been a fixed part of the canon from the beginning. "

Still a conspiracy theory. But the way you stated it was somewhat new.

"And no, this isn't the basis for my faith, because I would still have faith even if Satan was out of the picture. But that factor is why I'm skeptical about evolution and old earth theory. "

You're skeptical about evolution and old earth? Oh my. I'm sorry but this is a wild tangent you have now gone on. It should not be a factor at all, you still haven't been able to demonstrate the first claim that a God exists.

This is no different than Sandy Hook Conspiratards saying it was really the CIA that killed all those kids but all the evidence was covered up and more was planted to accuse Adam Lanza.
User avatar #53981 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I have no intention of demonstrating God's existence, as it is not mine to demonstrate. And I don't understand why you (meaning all atheists) keep making that same demand for evidence when you all know what the answer is going to be. The reason I left this board for so long was because the conversations were getting repetitive and stale. And you're one of the more prominent regulars here. I would hope you'd be more progressive in your discussions.
User avatar #53990 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
"I have no intention of demonstrating God's existence, as it is not mine to demonstrate. And I don't understand why you (meaning all atheists) keep making that same demand for evidence when you all know what the answer is going to be"

You have no intentions of proving that what you believe is true? How selfish of you. It IS your duty to demonstrate it, because you actively believe it. You support it. And you do so without any good reason which makes you dishonest. You make a special case for religion, a case that you don't apply to other beliefs that have the same amount of anecdotal evidence. And on top of this, you have the audacity to even think that followers of other religions have been misled and that those religions are false (even though they offer the same amount of evidence as your own).

The reason we stress evidence is because of the importance of believing things for good reasons. Our beliefs influence our actions and because of this, it's mutually beneficial for everyone to hold beliefs that are most adherent to reality. Your beliefs do not reflect reality.

Lets make a hypothetical and say that your religion is actually true 100%. You still currently have no reason to accept those claims and you are dishonest if you do. Belief should be held when the evidence supports it and not a moment sooner. And any God that rewards willful ignorance and punishes healthy skepticism is an immoral God that does not deserve worship.

"The reason I left this board for so long was because the conversations were getting repetitive and stale. And you're one of the more prominent regulars here. I would hope you'd be more progressive in your discussions. "

Explain to me how to be progressive? Our arguments remain the same because your religion remains the same. We are the ones open to change, while it seems you are not. You want to talk about repetitive and stale, then take a good long look at your Bible and the arguments in support of it.
User avatar #53993 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
And what about all the other things people believe in without proof? Should I never date again, and give up on m goal of one day being married? Because those things are based on trust and loyalty. They might cheat on me, and be so good at it that I never find out. Am I then dishonest for trusting them?
User avatar #54000 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
Know your battles. Belief and hope are separate things. I personally hope there is an afterlife so that I can see my family and what not. It's a nice thought, but that is where it ends for me.

Secondly, some things are okay to believe with just anecdotal evidence. If somebody told me that as a child they nearly drowned to death, I am perfectly okay with accepting that without proof. The claim is not extraordinary. We know it is a common occurrence, especially with children. It is a completely reasonable claim and ultimately matters little if it happens to not be true.
But comparing that to the very nature of our existence, to how we are suppose to live our life, and to what happens at the end of life is a different matter entirely.

"They might cheat on me, and be so good at it that I never find out. Am I then dishonest for trusting them? "

It depends on if they are trustworthy. If you have never caught her in a lie(cheating) or at least never in anything serious, you then have no reason to suspect that she might be a liar(cheater) and therefore it is perfectly reasonable to assume she isn't cheating. If she turns out as a cheater, it's unfortunate and kick her to the curb.

The point is, if she didn't give you a reason to doubt, then don't doubt. If she didn't give you a reason to distrust, then don't distrust.

If she is good at keeping it a secret from you, so good that you never suspect her, then you are doing exactly what a rational person is supposed to be doing; not believing without reason. You are being honest in this situation.

But if this same situation applied and you get some wild, paranoid thought that she is cheating without having a good reason for thinking it, and then you confront her and accuse her of cheating, you are being dishonest. Even if she was indeed cheating, the fact that you accused her without having a rational reason would make you dishonest.
User avatar #54016 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I think you interpreted my analogy backwards. I meant it like this:

God exists = my wife is faithful and I'm right in trusting her
God doesn't exist = my wife is cheating on me but I don't know it, so I trust her anyway
User avatar #54092 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
No, I think you didn't understand my point to begin with, which is why you felt the need to create some analogy in the first place.

"God exists = my wife is faithful and I'm right in trusting her
God doesn't exist = my wife is cheating on me but I don't know it, so I trust her anyway"

I must be honest, I have no clue what you are trying to explain with this analogy. It certainly doesn't reflect the point I was trying to make. I have no idea how the existence or nonexistence of a God is equivalent to a faithful or cheating wife and your ability to trust her.

Maybe you should start again with my original point and work from there.
User avatar #54093 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
All right, fair enough. Please reiterate it, as it's your point.
User avatar #54094 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
My point is that a person should withhold belief until they have a good reason in order to stay honest.
User avatar #53911 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Why do you speak about ''deities'' and ''ill intentions''?
User avatar #53913 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
This is religion board and I am replying to a comment in support of deities that have ill intentions?
User avatar #53914 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Which ''deities'' have ill intentions according to you?
User avatar #53915 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
None, I was not the claimant. I am the person challenging the silly notion.
User avatar #53916 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Oh. srry tl;dr most of this thread. I was gonna go on about the reason this world is as fucked as it is and not many get assistance from a higher being. The deity known as God is watching the humanity he created tear itself apart in wars and corruption all over the world, but there's a specific reason for it.
User avatar #53917 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
It seems like everyone has their own theory about it all, I wonder which theory is right if any of them at all. And how would someone know which was right? And why believe until you do?
User avatar #53918 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Eh. Well, my theory is basic. God controls a court of higher beings known as the angels, archangels, and other deities that reign the heavens with him, and watch over us. We, were the first, on his appearance, but not the first of his creations, and he watched as how his traitorous arch angel rebelled on earth and made his creations turn against him. God had two options. Destroy us instantly, or let us continue, and see if what the arch angel said was going to be fulfilled. His words were : I will make every being on this earth forget that you exist. And so, God granted him a certain ammount of time for him to do this. He did this because if he just destroyed us he would be seen as an evil, cowardly God who never gave his subjects a chance. Though he knew of the consequences that letting us roam free in a world controlled by an evil deity, he still gave us the chance, to prove to all of his servants that: He's right, he's magnanimous and benevolent, and of course, if this were to happen again, to destroy his next creations on an instant.
User avatar #53984 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I like that theory, but it's got some holes. You say He had the option to "see if what the archangel said was going to be fulfilled." The problem with that is that God is omniscient. He doesn't need to "see if" anything will happen because He already knows. The second problem is that you said He didn't want to be seen as cowardly. If God cared even the slightest about what we thought of Him, then I'm sure he'd use a course of action that didn't result in so many people calling him evil and cruel and all that negative shit.
User avatar #53921 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
Right. But you skipped the portion that gives you reason to suggest a God exists. And then somehow formulated this theory, but I don't know where from. It's the equivalent of me writing a story and then believing in it.
User avatar #53922 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Bible. Read about the war of the heavens in which his second son Lucifer rebelled against him. And I know God exists because Lucifer's minions roam earth and can be contacted by the right persons.
#53925 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
Lucifer is not in the bible
User avatar #53924 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
So The Bible is true because The Bible says so?
Yes, mostly anyone familiar with Christian teachings know about the war, but you have taken this basic idea, expanded upon it and thrown a bit of politics and reasoning for God and the devil, which is why it is your theory. I am asking how you came to any of this information. To quote my crazy grandmother "If The Bible doesn't say it, it isn't true." (speaking to me as a young child when I noticed some of the flaws and tried to make sense of them by reasoning)

If you know, enlighten us. Please once and for all end the disagreements between atheists and Christians(and other religions) and demonstrate it.

User avatar #53838 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Where did God begin?
User avatar #53878 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Thread ran out.

I like it, but the text appears kind of slowly. I'd try to speed that part up if you can. Other than that it looks awesome
User avatar #53879 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
thanks man
User avatar #53880 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
No prob.
#53881 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Like this?
User avatar #53884 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Hmm it looks about the same to me.
User avatar #53886 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
its faster by 2fps/second
User avatar #53888 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Ohh. Well I just meant the words being made from the bullet holes, I feel like it takes a long time for them to appear.
User avatar #53890 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
it's a pistol and it's not that fast.......
User avatar #53891 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Haha, fair enough.
User avatar #53840 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
He didn't "begin". He always was. And furthermore, part of being omnipresent means He exists everywhere.
User avatar #53847 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Holy shit my first OC GIF on FJ : D
#53844 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
User avatar #53849 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I don't understand, I'm sorry. I mean I think I kinda get what the graphic means, but the Putin throws me off completely.
User avatar #53850 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Putin is love
Putin is life
User avatar #53858 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
And that's not his dog.
I always thought his dog was black.
User avatar #53860 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
k
User avatar #53867 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
top doge
User avatar #53851 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well, I do agree with his stance on Sharia Law. So he gets points for that.
User avatar #53852 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
<3
Are you ready to conver to Putinism?

Well you gota being somewhere.
User avatar #53853 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I'd have to learn more about him. What other policies does he have?
#53854 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Putin for lunch and dinner.
User avatar #53857 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Hmmm. I'm growing increasingly tempted.
User avatar #53859 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Wonder what is for breakfast?
#53864 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
User avatar #53875 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
I made my gif, wana see it?
User avatar #53876 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Sure.
#53877 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
How do you like it?
User avatar #53843 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
gif wont work wait
#53842 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
#53830 - Well there isn't much point in getting freaked out about somet…  [+] (10 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
User avatar #53841 - thebritishguy (03/04/2014) [-]
There's a reason to say "I hope this doesn't happen soon" rather than " I hope this happens soon". I don't know what you mean by relief, I will be in hell, eternal anguish, the polar opposite of relief. I hope Christians aren't optimistic about Gods "final solution".
#53959 - anonymous (03/05/2014) [-]
As a Christian, I hope and pray it doesn't happen soon, because when it does it means no going back for those who don't believe. I look forward to heaven, but I still want as many people to be there too.
User avatar #53870 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well, the "relief" part was pretty much just from our perspective. From your perspective, it doesn't matter, since you don't believe in anything happening after you die. So you really have nothing to worry about. Like I'm sure you've said before, telling an atheist they'll go to hell is like telling an adult that Santa won't be bringing them any presents this Christmas.
User avatar #53871 - thebritishguy (03/04/2014) [-]
Ok, sorry I didn't understand you. Don't you dislike the idea of people like me getting killed and sent to hell early? wouldn't you prefer it that Jesus just waited longer or didn't come at all to avoid his final solution. I hope you're getting my reference point, Hitlers passion to get rid of all the Jews and other humans he deemed subhuman in a mass genocide so that there would be a world of traditional, cheery, patriarchal Aryans. It seems similar to Gods plan.
User avatar #53872 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Yes, I dislike the idea of people going to hell. I don't understand why it has to be that way. But I'm not God, and I don't have the infinite wisdom and righteousness that He has. So I leave those decisions up to Him. The is, though, that this is going to happen. I can pray it away all I want, but He's made his decision. It's inevitable. And no matter how long He prolongs it, when the time comes for it to happen, it will always feel like it's too soon. So it doesn't matter when it happens, because it will be devastating and horrible for them no matter what. I'm not happy that they will have to suffer like that, but I've accepted it as an inevitability. That being said, I have to set aside my emotional reaction to it, or else it would eat away at me for the rest of my life. Nothing good comes from bad emotions, except the opportunity to better one's own self. So the best thing I can do, since I can't stop the devastation of the apocalypse, is to better my own self in preparation to be saved, and encourage as many people as I can to do the same. There's nothing else I can do, is there? (That's not rhetorical, I'm genuinely curious as to what you would have me do.)
User avatar #53898 - thebritishguy (03/04/2014) [-]
I don't want you to do anything but I don't like it when people are enthusiastic about the apocalypse as you said originally. How do you think it looks to me when I see people praying and begging for my destruction? Or old men who are thirsty for my torture and for it all to end? it's gross. I don't like it when people are enthusiastic or excited over this kind of thing.

But also on what basis do you judge God? if you think that Gods infinitely wise (whatever that means) and you can't say that he's wrong, then on what basis do you judge him as right? how can you say he is good if you can't judge him on the bad he does? Anybody is good if whenever they do something bad you say "well I can't judge you for the bad thing" you could look at Stalin and say "Well I can't judge you for those Gulags, but you have a lovely mustache so you're good"
User avatar #53904 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
The destruction is not the part we're excited for. Here, let me try a different analogy. Imagine a small town that is in desperate need of a hospital, because people keep getting hurt or sick and end up dying before they can reach the nearest hospital. And in order to make room to build this hospital, they have to tear down a large section of residences. Now all the people that lived in that section have to be kicked out of there homes. That's awful and nobody wants to do that, but it's necessary, because the hospital is going to save countless lives. The people who aren't losing there homes probably don't want that to happen, but they still rejoice in the new hospital.

As for the second part of what you said, it's not there's a right and wrong and God is always in the right, it's that God makes decisions, and those decisions become right. See, there is no authority over God. No one to draw the line between moral and immoral. No one for Him to defy. So He draws the line Himself, and thus, everything He does is perfect, because there's nothing to compare it to. As a result, anyone that doesn't live up to His standard (which is basically everyone) is thereby imperfect. So to recap, God sets the standard of what is right, and so anything else is wrong.
User avatar #53908 - thebritishguy (03/04/2014) [-]
You already have a hospital after you "die" so you don't need to kill civilians. In fact you don't have to kill anyone because omnipotence stops anyone from needing to do anything. However the real crime is the sadomasochism of eternal torture. It's like all you had to do was wait a bit for a hospital but you want the hospital early at the cost of millions of lives.

You seem to believe in some kind of objective moral standard as if there's a ruler like in Mary Poppins which can measure how good you are. However morality is just a projection or opinion, there can't be a line, there isn't something which is measurably or factually immoral. Also this is very dangerous thinking is it not? because if you mis understand Gods words or if someone misused Gods words as they have been and continue to do ever since man asked "Why?", you can justify any act. "Genocide? God want it so it's ok" "smashing babies against rocks? God wants it so it's ok" You have found a loophole to justify anything.
User avatar #53912 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
This isn't a discussion about the morality of God's actions toward humanity, it's a discussion about how we as humans respond to His actions. Say what you will about the eternal torment, but a moment ago you were only criticizing me for the way I felt about the imminent apocalypse.

See, that's one more thing you and I will have to agree to disagree on, because we as Christians believe that, yes, morality very much is black and white, and you can only be either infinitely righteous or infinitely sinful. All humans have fallen short of the perfection of God, which means all of us are infinitely sinful. "There is no one righteous, not even one." (Romans 3:10). "Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters." (Matthew 12:30). The beauty of grace, however, is that even though we've all turned against Him, through Christ, He has given us the opportunity to return to Him. So when you say that it's cruel or unjust to send billions of people to hell, remember that He offers everyone a chance to be saved. It's just a matter of choosing to accept it.
User avatar #54062 - thebritishguy (03/05/2014) [-]
You know how conversations work, it progresses and delves into different aspects of the issue. If you know you will go to heaven after you die I don't know why you want an apocalypse now, knowing that I will die as well as others.

These words are nonsense words, you can't be infinitely anything because infinite is a mathematical concept. I'm not responsible for what someone who is an ancient ancestor did. If I was then I'd be a rapist, murderer, soldier, thief etc. because there must be many of those in mine or any lineage. You know that not everyone gets a choice as a very large amount of people have never heard the gospels as they live in other cultures, epochs or just don't have Christian parents. My acceptance depends a lot on my belief on the proposition, even if I did believe though I find human sacrifice morally reprehensible and so would be reserved about accepting a human sacrifice. I don't know why the test is mainly on my ability to believe in things without evidence or reason though because if I was gullible and gave into group pressure I wouldn't be more loving or caring, but I would be destined for heaven while people like Gandhi, Malcolm X and Carl Sagan who really changed the world would be in hell.
#53823 - All righty. You were making a point about God killing many peo…  [+] (93 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
#53974 - nigeltheoutlaw (03/05/2014) [-]
What makes your god any more valid or likely than the hundreds of other gods out there?
User avatar #53979 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
As far as I know, nothing. It's just a personal choice.
#53980 - nigeltheoutlaw (03/05/2014) [-]
Then why pick that one among all of the others? Why pick at all if they're all equally likely?
User avatar #54005 - schnizel (03/05/2014) [-]
It's right for him if he thinks so.
User avatar #54019 - nigeltheoutlaw (03/05/2014) [-]
I know, I was just trying to understand why he thought this one was right was all.
User avatar #54025 - schnizel (03/05/2014) [-]
k
User avatar #53982 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I'd rather take a 1-in-3000 chance of going to heaven than a 1-in-1 chance of going to hell.
User avatar #53983 - nigeltheoutlaw (03/05/2014) [-]
Many other religions have a hell, so increase that proportion significantly. Not only that, but if your only motivation for believing in God is to not go to Hell then I doubt you'll get in for dishonesty anyways. Additionally, many, many sects of Christianity all claim that if you don't follow their particular flavor then you will go to Hell, so that increases your chances of Hell even more. What sect do you follow, by the way?
User avatar #53985 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I was merely answering the second part of your question, explaining why I'm not an atheist. I'm well aware that other religions have hell too, hence the 1-in-3000 odds.

And avoiding hell is the whole reason Christianity exists. Our God is Jesus Christ, who died on the cross specifically to save us from hell. If you want me to sugarcoat it, I'll rephrase: I believe in God so that when I die I can return to Him in heaven for eternity. But that's basically the same as saying I just don't want to go to hell. It's not dishonest, as you say.

Sect is not the most accurate term. That refers to much smaller organizations. The word you're looking for is denomination. And I was raised in a Baptist family, but I know longer identify as that, or as any denomination for that matter, because we all share the same Bible (excluding Catholicism, but that's a whole other story). And the Bible, while admittedly difficult to understand in many aspects, is very clear and straightforward about exactly how to receive salvation. It never says you must belong to any specific denomination or sub-class of Christianity, nor does it even mention Christianity at all. The one and only requirement for redemption, as noted countless times in the text, is submission to Jesus Christ, accepting Him as your Lord and Savior. Anyone who claims there is more to it than that is denying the Word of God.
User avatar #53986 - nigeltheoutlaw (03/05/2014) [-]
My point with other religions having hell is that following Christianity as a "get out of Hell" card is far from a sure thing since there are a lot of other hells to go to. Again, this is little more than a shot in the dark since they're all equally likely options.

That feels like weak reasoning, but if you don't think so then maybe God won't either.

Either way, Mormonism, Jehova's Witnesses, Catholics, Methodists, Pentecostals, Catholics, Orthodox Christians, etc. all interpret the Bible differently and claim that only their interpretation will lead you to God. Are they going to go to Hell for claiming that in spite of submission to Jesus Christ?
User avatar #53987 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I understand the point you were trying to make. I wasn't trying to say that Christianity is my "get out of hell" card. I was saying that given the choice of believing in any religion, and not believing in any religion, I'd rather believe in any religion, because believing in something, no matter what it is, means you have a chance of going to heaven, whereas being an atheist is a guaranteed way to go to hell (assuming any of those religions are correct. If atheism is correct then it doesn't matter anyway).

And no, they're not necessarily going to hell, I don't think. But they're tacking on extra stuff that the Bible doesn't say, and that's pointless and unnecessary.
User avatar #53988 - nigeltheoutlaw (03/05/2014) [-]
So a shot in the dark is better than not shooting at all? I guess that's understandable.

I guess, but Mass rocks. Free wine is never a bad thing.
User avatar #53989 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
Meh. I don't drink. In the Baptist Church, or at least in the ones I attended, communion was served with grape juice. Which is basically what wine was in Jesus' time. I mean it was still somewhat alcoholic back then, but much, much less so than it is now.
User avatar #53991 - nigeltheoutlaw (03/05/2014) [-]
Yeah, I was joking about the wine. I can't stand it personally. The importance is the symbolism rather than the alcohol.
User avatar #53994 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
Exactly.
User avatar #53995 - nigeltheoutlaw (03/05/2014) [-]
Well, thank you for explaining your reasoning. I don't agree with it, but it's important to see how other people think in case you realize that your position was wrong all along.
User avatar #53996 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
Anytime, bro.
User avatar #53828 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Yep.
>2014
>Not worshiping the old gods
User avatar #53834 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I think, considering that the Judeo-Christian God is omnipresent, and therefore existed eternally before anything began, He is pretty much the oldest God thing there is.
User avatar #53839 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
If I may ask one thing: So your god is falsifyable? Since if he is omnipresent, wich itself would violate countless physical laws, he must be part of our reality, and our 4-bran spacetime, wich means necessarily that he is falsifyable.
User avatar #53845 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
If He existed eternally, then what makes you think He's bound by the physical laws of our dimensions? Our universe has been proven to be finite, yes? So if He exists, and is indeed eternal, then He must exist outside our 4-dimensional plane of existence.
User avatar #53856 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
what, you think he exists in the bulk?
Have you any faintest idea of particle physics?
Also: The other 6 dimenions are "rolled up", or structured, in such a way that strings can only wrap arround them, but not exist between several of these dimensions.
Also: IF. The concept I'm basing my views on, is supported by incredible amounts of evidence. Is yours based on any evidence at all?
Also: "Dimensions" is not just a loose term you can just throw arround.
And yes, he has to be bound by physical laws, since these "laws" are just how we express what reality is and how everything exists.
So yes, it could be that the 'laws' of physics don't apply to him/it.
But that would mean that he isn't part of reality, and therefore not real.
User avatar #53861 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well then reality must be relative, because all that means is that He's not real in accordance with our definition of what is real. But He can certainly exist regardless of that. He's just too abstract to comprehend.
User avatar #53863 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
So what you're saying is: Oh, if by the consequences of the definition of reality and that wat we know to apply to it he can't be true, instead of correcting your own view you are saying that the definition of reality should be canged?
That 's a poor excuse.

Also: The phrase: "He's just too abstract to understand" is the intelectual equivalent of shouting "ohh, look over there" and running away.
You can't just CLAIM that he's to abstract, that has no value whatsoever in an argument.
You need to prove your claims, or they can be disregarded as bullshit.
"That wich is postulated without evidence can be dissmissed without evidence."
#53897 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
Obviously God is not going to be in accordance with modern physics because he is above everything. By using science facts and quotes by humans to back up your claims is a bad argument because God is not bound by what we humans understand him to be, we will never be able to understand God so obviously he is going to go against science or that quote you used
User avatar #53899 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
That's still not a fact, that's a baseless claim, without facts backing it up.
#53895 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
there are many facts to back up the claim that God is too abstract to understand.
User avatar #53896 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
Name them.
User avatar #53866 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well what do you expect me to do? I'm perfectly content with my beliefs without proof, and that's entirely what faith is. You can't just demand that I try to formulate an argument based on your own standards and then get mad at me when you don't like my answer. I'm not trying to bullshit my belief into complying with your views. I just have my views in spite of yours.
User avatar #53868 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
I'm not mad, and I'm not trying to force you. I'm just saying that judging by avaluable evidence about reality your god can't exist.
And I don't expect you to change your views because I don't like them.
But still, faith is a bad reason.
It's irrational to accept something blindly without evidence, or contrary to facts.
#53900 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
Of course you will see it as irrational because that is what comes to your mind when you can't prove something. Believing in something doesn't mean you have to see it. We humans won't be able to see who God truly is and so as a result people will just use that as a basis to claim his nonexistence
User avatar #53902 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
I wan't using that we can't see god as an argument, shit, we can't even see ultraviolet on our own.
I was saying that the god jokeface defined can't exist in this reality, by definition.
And you still haven't lived up one bit to your claim that you have any evidence.
Why not provide that evidence, and log in.
User avatar #53869 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
The way I see it, faith has no adverse effect on life so long as it doesn't impact your ability to function successfully within the world. And my faith doesn't inhibit me from living a happy, healthy lifestyle. I still enjoy learning from science and whatnot, I just think it's wrong about some of the details about our origin story. But I accept and embrace all the progress it has made in terms of engineering, medicine, and so forth. So please understand that having faith in God does not have to prevent a person from still being leading a rational life.
User avatar #53836 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
>Illyrian faith founded 4th century BC
>Christ was born 2000 yaers ago
check yo dates
User avatar #53837 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I'm not talking about when the religions were historically founded. I'm talking about the ages of the gods within the context of their respective religions. If Judaism and Christianity are correct, then God always existed. As for the "old gods", I don't know which gods you're referring to, but whichever ones they are, I doubt they can top eternal existence. Tie, maybe, if they are eternal too, but that's it.
User avatar #53855 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
This brings up a problem with the continuity of your religion. You see, you have a period of about a thousand years after the oldest known religion was being practiced where the Judeo Christian God is not mentioned anywhere in the world according to current findings. But you have several other religions shown being practiced during this period, many of which are drastically different.

My point being is that mankind would have started out knowing about God according to the biblical record and the archeology should reflect this. It doesn't. There is a period of non-existance and then suddenly, poof, it shows up well after other beliefs have been long established.
User avatar #53862 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Even the Bible addresses the fact that other religions existed before Judaism. They're called Pagan religions, and the OT is chock full of them. That's why God is often referred to as "the God of Abraham" or "the God of Jacob" etc, instead of just "God". Because if they just called Him God, then nobody would know which God they were referring to. And those Pagan religions came about the same way you think Judaism and Christianity came about. By people just trying to fill in the gaps of what they didn't understand.
User avatar #53873 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
You missed the point. The point is that your judaic god was not apart of human history despite what your bible claims according to all of the available archaeological evidence until about 1000 years after language began writing down religion.

Considering gods have not yet been demonstrated, it is far more probable that the judaic accounts are as fabricated as all of your pagan gods.
User avatar #53874 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Yes, it's extremely probable. That odds against our faith are staggering. But that's irrelevant, because we don't base our faith on odds. Nor on archaeology, for that matter. If we did, then no one would deny evolution, old earth theory, etc. But we believe that history can lie, just as easily as religious texts can lie. I've said this before, if you were a supernatural entity who chose to use your powers to collapse man's faith in God, wouldn't your first move be to fabricate a bunch of evidence to falsely discredit Him? I mean, that's what I would do.
User avatar #53910 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
"Yes, it's extremely probable. That odds against our faith are staggering."

Umm what? odds staggering = extremely probable?

"But that's irrelevant, because we don't base our faith on odds. "

You don't base your faith on anything really...that is why its faith. I suppose you could say you base it on hope, but hope doesn't prove anything now does it?

"Nor on archaeology, for that matter. If we did, then no one would deny evolution, old earth theory, etc"

Kind of the point. Right here you are basically admitting that you are being willfully blind/ignorant. You acknowledge that reality suggests otherwise, but you continue to have faith anyway. For what reasons? I'd assume personal comfort and the promise of a reward in face of a threatening eternal punishment.

" But we believe that history can lie, just as easily as religious texts can lie."

Well you see, that's what makes history so great. Because it doesn't all come from a single biased source most of the time. Because of this, we're able to sort out the liars and don't accept it.

"I've said this before, if you were a supernatural entity who chose to use your powers to collapse man's faith in God, wouldn't your first move be to fabricate a bunch of evidence to falsely discredit Him?"

What? Is this a new, deeper form of delusion? Now it's christian conspiracy theories? And is this really your basis for continuing to have faith?

This assumes the supernatural is real. This assumes deities are real. This assumes that a deity has ill intentions against another. This assumes that evidence is planted to the contrary. This assumes that intelligent deities would think as mortal men would.

And ultimately, even if you were right and some evil deity was purposely misleading the majority of mankind, your loving God is still a dick for allowing it to happen. And he's a even a bigger dick for continuing to punish man for things out of their control. He was already a dick for giving infinite punishments for finite crimes.
User avatar #53920 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I'm not going to address all of those individually, because I'm really just focused on the last one right now. Believing in an evil deity who exists just to counter everything God does is not a "Christian conspiracy theory", it's one of the largest aspects of the entire religion. Satan was an angel who rebelled against god and was cast out of heaven, and his entire modus operandi is tempting and deceiving people in order to lead them away from God. I didn't come up with this stuff, its been a fixed part of the canon from the beginning. And no, this isn't the basis for my faith, because I would still have faith even if Satan was out of the picture. But that factor is why I'm skeptical about evolution and old earth theory.
User avatar #53923 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
"its been a fixed part of the canon from the beginning. "

Still a conspiracy theory. But the way you stated it was somewhat new.

"And no, this isn't the basis for my faith, because I would still have faith even if Satan was out of the picture. But that factor is why I'm skeptical about evolution and old earth theory. "

You're skeptical about evolution and old earth? Oh my. I'm sorry but this is a wild tangent you have now gone on. It should not be a factor at all, you still haven't been able to demonstrate the first claim that a God exists.

This is no different than Sandy Hook Conspiratards saying it was really the CIA that killed all those kids but all the evidence was covered up and more was planted to accuse Adam Lanza.
User avatar #53981 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I have no intention of demonstrating God's existence, as it is not mine to demonstrate. And I don't understand why you (meaning all atheists) keep making that same demand for evidence when you all know what the answer is going to be. The reason I left this board for so long was because the conversations were getting repetitive and stale. And you're one of the more prominent regulars here. I would hope you'd be more progressive in your discussions.
User avatar #53990 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
"I have no intention of demonstrating God's existence, as it is not mine to demonstrate. And I don't understand why you (meaning all atheists) keep making that same demand for evidence when you all know what the answer is going to be"

You have no intentions of proving that what you believe is true? How selfish of you. It IS your duty to demonstrate it, because you actively believe it. You support it. And you do so without any good reason which makes you dishonest. You make a special case for religion, a case that you don't apply to other beliefs that have the same amount of anecdotal evidence. And on top of this, you have the audacity to even think that followers of other religions have been misled and that those religions are false (even though they offer the same amount of evidence as your own).

The reason we stress evidence is because of the importance of believing things for good reasons. Our beliefs influence our actions and because of this, it's mutually beneficial for everyone to hold beliefs that are most adherent to reality. Your beliefs do not reflect reality.

Lets make a hypothetical and say that your religion is actually true 100%. You still currently have no reason to accept those claims and you are dishonest if you do. Belief should be held when the evidence supports it and not a moment sooner. And any God that rewards willful ignorance and punishes healthy skepticism is an immoral God that does not deserve worship.

"The reason I left this board for so long was because the conversations were getting repetitive and stale. And you're one of the more prominent regulars here. I would hope you'd be more progressive in your discussions. "

Explain to me how to be progressive? Our arguments remain the same because your religion remains the same. We are the ones open to change, while it seems you are not. You want to talk about repetitive and stale, then take a good long look at your Bible and the arguments in support of it.
User avatar #53993 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
And what about all the other things people believe in without proof? Should I never date again, and give up on m goal of one day being married? Because those things are based on trust and loyalty. They might cheat on me, and be so good at it that I never find out. Am I then dishonest for trusting them?
User avatar #54000 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
Know your battles. Belief and hope are separate things. I personally hope there is an afterlife so that I can see my family and what not. It's a nice thought, but that is where it ends for me.

Secondly, some things are okay to believe with just anecdotal evidence. If somebody told me that as a child they nearly drowned to death, I am perfectly okay with accepting that without proof. The claim is not extraordinary. We know it is a common occurrence, especially with children. It is a completely reasonable claim and ultimately matters little if it happens to not be true.
But comparing that to the very nature of our existence, to how we are suppose to live our life, and to what happens at the end of life is a different matter entirely.

"They might cheat on me, and be so good at it that I never find out. Am I then dishonest for trusting them? "

It depends on if they are trustworthy. If you have never caught her in a lie(cheating) or at least never in anything serious, you then have no reason to suspect that she might be a liar(cheater) and therefore it is perfectly reasonable to assume she isn't cheating. If she turns out as a cheater, it's unfortunate and kick her to the curb.

The point is, if she didn't give you a reason to doubt, then don't doubt. If she didn't give you a reason to distrust, then don't distrust.

If she is good at keeping it a secret from you, so good that you never suspect her, then you are doing exactly what a rational person is supposed to be doing; not believing without reason. You are being honest in this situation.

But if this same situation applied and you get some wild, paranoid thought that she is cheating without having a good reason for thinking it, and then you confront her and accuse her of cheating, you are being dishonest. Even if she was indeed cheating, the fact that you accused her without having a rational reason would make you dishonest.
User avatar #54016 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I think you interpreted my analogy backwards. I meant it like this:

God exists = my wife is faithful and I'm right in trusting her
God doesn't exist = my wife is cheating on me but I don't know it, so I trust her anyway
User avatar #54092 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
No, I think you didn't understand my point to begin with, which is why you felt the need to create some analogy in the first place.

"God exists = my wife is faithful and I'm right in trusting her
God doesn't exist = my wife is cheating on me but I don't know it, so I trust her anyway"

I must be honest, I have no clue what you are trying to explain with this analogy. It certainly doesn't reflect the point I was trying to make. I have no idea how the existence or nonexistence of a God is equivalent to a faithful or cheating wife and your ability to trust her.

Maybe you should start again with my original point and work from there.
User avatar #54093 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
All right, fair enough. Please reiterate it, as it's your point.
User avatar #54094 - eight (03/05/2014) [-]
My point is that a person should withhold belief until they have a good reason in order to stay honest.
User avatar #53911 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Why do you speak about ''deities'' and ''ill intentions''?
User avatar #53913 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
This is religion board and I am replying to a comment in support of deities that have ill intentions?
User avatar #53914 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Which ''deities'' have ill intentions according to you?
User avatar #53915 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
None, I was not the claimant. I am the person challenging the silly notion.
User avatar #53916 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Oh. srry tl;dr most of this thread. I was gonna go on about the reason this world is as fucked as it is and not many get assistance from a higher being. The deity known as God is watching the humanity he created tear itself apart in wars and corruption all over the world, but there's a specific reason for it.
User avatar #53917 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
It seems like everyone has their own theory about it all, I wonder which theory is right if any of them at all. And how would someone know which was right? And why believe until you do?
User avatar #53918 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Eh. Well, my theory is basic. God controls a court of higher beings known as the angels, archangels, and other deities that reign the heavens with him, and watch over us. We, were the first, on his appearance, but not the first of his creations, and he watched as how his traitorous arch angel rebelled on earth and made his creations turn against him. God had two options. Destroy us instantly, or let us continue, and see if what the arch angel said was going to be fulfilled. His words were : I will make every being on this earth forget that you exist. And so, God granted him a certain ammount of time for him to do this. He did this because if he just destroyed us he would be seen as an evil, cowardly God who never gave his subjects a chance. Though he knew of the consequences that letting us roam free in a world controlled by an evil deity, he still gave us the chance, to prove to all of his servants that: He's right, he's magnanimous and benevolent, and of course, if this were to happen again, to destroy his next creations on an instant.
User avatar #53984 - jokeface (03/05/2014) [-]
I like that theory, but it's got some holes. You say He had the option to "see if what the archangel said was going to be fulfilled." The problem with that is that God is omniscient. He doesn't need to "see if" anything will happen because He already knows. The second problem is that you said He didn't want to be seen as cowardly. If God cared even the slightest about what we thought of Him, then I'm sure he'd use a course of action that didn't result in so many people calling him evil and cruel and all that negative shit.
User avatar #53921 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
Right. But you skipped the portion that gives you reason to suggest a God exists. And then somehow formulated this theory, but I don't know where from. It's the equivalent of me writing a story and then believing in it.
User avatar #53922 - jondajp (03/04/2014) [-]
Bible. Read about the war of the heavens in which his second son Lucifer rebelled against him. And I know God exists because Lucifer's minions roam earth and can be contacted by the right persons.
#53925 - anonymous (03/04/2014) [-]
Lucifer is not in the bible
User avatar #53924 - eight (03/04/2014) [-]
So The Bible is true because The Bible says so?
Yes, mostly anyone familiar with Christian teachings know about the war, but you have taken this basic idea, expanded upon it and thrown a bit of politics and reasoning for God and the devil, which is why it is your theory. I am asking how you came to any of this information. To quote my crazy grandmother "If The Bible doesn't say it, it isn't true." (speaking to me as a young child when I noticed some of the flaws and tried to make sense of them by reasoning)

If you know, enlighten us. Please once and for all end the disagreements between atheists and Christians(and other religions) and demonstrate it.

User avatar #53838 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Where did God begin?
User avatar #53878 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Thread ran out.

I like it, but the text appears kind of slowly. I'd try to speed that part up if you can. Other than that it looks awesome
User avatar #53879 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
thanks man
User avatar #53880 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
No prob.
#53881 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Like this?
User avatar #53884 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Hmm it looks about the same to me.
User avatar #53886 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
its faster by 2fps/second
User avatar #53888 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Ohh. Well I just meant the words being made from the bullet holes, I feel like it takes a long time for them to appear.
User avatar #53890 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
it's a pistol and it's not that fast.......
User avatar #53891 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Haha, fair enough.
User avatar #53840 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
He didn't "begin". He always was. And furthermore, part of being omnipresent means He exists everywhere.
User avatar #53847 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Holy shit my first OC GIF on FJ : D
#53844 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
User avatar #53849 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I don't understand, I'm sorry. I mean I think I kinda get what the graphic means, but the Putin throws me off completely.
User avatar #53850 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Putin is love
Putin is life
User avatar #53858 - metalmind (03/04/2014) [-]
And that's not his dog.
I always thought his dog was black.
User avatar #53860 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
k
User avatar #53867 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
top doge
User avatar #53851 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well, I do agree with his stance on Sharia Law. So he gets points for that.
User avatar #53852 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
<3
Are you ready to conver to Putinism?

Well you gota being somewhere.
User avatar #53853 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
I'd have to learn more about him. What other policies does he have?
#53854 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Putin for lunch and dinner.
User avatar #53857 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Hmmm. I'm growing increasingly tempted.
User avatar #53859 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Wonder what is for breakfast?
#53864 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
User avatar #53875 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
I made my gif, wana see it?
User avatar #53876 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Sure.
#53877 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
How do you like it?
User avatar #53843 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
gif wont work wait
#53842 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
#53820 - Take your time. I've got nothing going on for the next 4 hours. 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
#53818 - Thank you, but that's not the one I'm thinking of. It's worded… 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
#53812 - Bro I was just looking for a Bible verse. You wanna talk moral…  [+] (2 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
User avatar #53813 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Ok.
I'm gona be slow, I'm making my GIF?
User avatar #53820 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Take your time. I've got nothing going on for the next 4 hours.
#53804 - We don't believe evil was "made" by god, we believe …  [+] (4 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
User avatar #53807 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Well if you look at who killed more people you should look at Adanoi The big G . And all Lucifer wanted is to give man freedom and power.
User avatar #53812 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Bro I was just looking for a Bible verse. You wanna talk morality, we can start a new thread for that.
User avatar #53813 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Ok.
I'm gona be slow, I'm making my GIF?
User avatar #53820 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Take your time. I've got nothing going on for the next 4 hours.
#53798 - Judeo-Christian.  [+] (6 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
User avatar #53800 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Well, evil was made by him to "test" people and good is made by him so that people stay on his side and if they were not on his side they go to hell if they are they get heaven. But wait, there is more. Your good old schnizy here would still take lucifers side.
User avatar #53804 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
We don't believe evil was "made" by god, we believe it is caused by anyone who defies Him, which began with Lucifer who then spread ti to humans. And regardless, that doesn't exactly help me with the verse. But thank you anyway.
User avatar #53807 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Well if you look at who killed more people you should look at Adanoi The big G . And all Lucifer wanted is to give man freedom and power.
User avatar #53812 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Bro I was just looking for a Bible verse. You wanna talk morality, we can start a new thread for that.
User avatar #53813 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Ok.
I'm gona be slow, I'm making my GIF?
User avatar #53820 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Take your time. I've got nothing going on for the next 4 hours.
#53793 - First of all, whom* Second of all, evil by God's stan…  [+] (8 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
User avatar #53797 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
I'm making a flash animation and I can't focus on grammar.
Which God?
User avatar #53798 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Judeo-Christian.
User avatar #53800 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Well, evil was made by him to "test" people and good is made by him so that people stay on his side and if they were not on his side they go to hell if they are they get heaven. But wait, there is more. Your good old schnizy here would still take lucifers side.
User avatar #53804 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
We don't believe evil was "made" by god, we believe it is caused by anyone who defies Him, which began with Lucifer who then spread ti to humans. And regardless, that doesn't exactly help me with the verse. But thank you anyway.
User avatar #53807 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Well if you look at who killed more people you should look at Adanoi The big G . And all Lucifer wanted is to give man freedom and power.
User avatar #53812 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Bro I was just looking for a Bible verse. You wanna talk morality, we can start a new thread for that.
User avatar #53813 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Ok.
I'm gona be slow, I'm making my GIF?
User avatar #53820 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Take your time. I've got nothing going on for the next 4 hours.
#53791 - "At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be giv… 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
#53788 - Is it wrong to be enthusiastic about the return of our Lord?  [+] (13 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
User avatar #53826 - thebritishguy (03/04/2014) [-]
If your lord is going to kill me and my friends then yes
#53825 - thebritishguy has deleted their comment.
User avatar #53830 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well there isn't much point in getting freaked out about something that's going to happen whether you like it or not. You can't stop it, so the best thing to do, in my opinion, is focus on the good that will come of it. Like, let's say you were scheduled to have a root canal. And for whatever reason, it's literally impossible to cancel it. You know it's got to happen, so why bother fretting? Just focus on the relief that will come when it's over. Stay optimistic. That's the mentality that we as Christians have. Or that we should have, anyway.
User avatar #53841 - thebritishguy (03/04/2014) [-]
There's a reason to say "I hope this doesn't happen soon" rather than " I hope this happens soon". I don't know what you mean by relief, I will be in hell, eternal anguish, the polar opposite of relief. I hope Christians aren't optimistic about Gods "final solution".
#53959 - anonymous (03/05/2014) [-]
As a Christian, I hope and pray it doesn't happen soon, because when it does it means no going back for those who don't believe. I look forward to heaven, but I still want as many people to be there too.
User avatar #53870 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Well, the "relief" part was pretty much just from our perspective. From your perspective, it doesn't matter, since you don't believe in anything happening after you die. So you really have nothing to worry about. Like I'm sure you've said before, telling an atheist they'll go to hell is like telling an adult that Santa won't be bringing them any presents this Christmas.
User avatar #53871 - thebritishguy (03/04/2014) [-]
Ok, sorry I didn't understand you. Don't you dislike the idea of people like me getting killed and sent to hell early? wouldn't you prefer it that Jesus just waited longer or didn't come at all to avoid his final solution. I hope you're getting my reference point, Hitlers passion to get rid of all the Jews and other humans he deemed subhuman in a mass genocide so that there would be a world of traditional, cheery, patriarchal Aryans. It seems similar to Gods plan.
User avatar #53872 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Yes, I dislike the idea of people going to hell. I don't understand why it has to be that way. But I'm not God, and I don't have the infinite wisdom and righteousness that He has. So I leave those decisions up to Him. The is, though, that this is going to happen. I can pray it away all I want, but He's made his decision. It's inevitable. And no matter how long He prolongs it, when the time comes for it to happen, it will always feel like it's too soon. So it doesn't matter when it happens, because it will be devastating and horrible for them no matter what. I'm not happy that they will have to suffer like that, but I've accepted it as an inevitability. That being said, I have to set aside my emotional reaction to it, or else it would eat away at me for the rest of my life. Nothing good comes from bad emotions, except the opportunity to better one's own self. So the best thing I can do, since I can't stop the devastation of the apocalypse, is to better my own self in preparation to be saved, and encourage as many people as I can to do the same. There's nothing else I can do, is there? (That's not rhetorical, I'm genuinely curious as to what you would have me do.)
User avatar #53898 - thebritishguy (03/04/2014) [-]
I don't want you to do anything but I don't like it when people are enthusiastic about the apocalypse as you said originally. How do you think it looks to me when I see people praying and begging for my destruction? Or old men who are thirsty for my torture and for it all to end? it's gross. I don't like it when people are enthusiastic or excited over this kind of thing.

But also on what basis do you judge God? if you think that Gods infinitely wise (whatever that means) and you can't say that he's wrong, then on what basis do you judge him as right? how can you say he is good if you can't judge him on the bad he does? Anybody is good if whenever they do something bad you say "well I can't judge you for the bad thing" you could look at Stalin and say "Well I can't judge you for those Gulags, but you have a lovely mustache so you're good"
User avatar #53904 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
The destruction is not the part we're excited for. Here, let me try a different analogy. Imagine a small town that is in desperate need of a hospital, because people keep getting hurt or sick and end up dying before they can reach the nearest hospital. And in order to make room to build this hospital, they have to tear down a large section of residences. Now all the people that lived in that section have to be kicked out of there homes. That's awful and nobody wants to do that, but it's necessary, because the hospital is going to save countless lives. The people who aren't losing there homes probably don't want that to happen, but they still rejoice in the new hospital.

As for the second part of what you said, it's not there's a right and wrong and God is always in the right, it's that God makes decisions, and those decisions become right. See, there is no authority over God. No one to draw the line between moral and immoral. No one for Him to defy. So He draws the line Himself, and thus, everything He does is perfect, because there's nothing to compare it to. As a result, anyone that doesn't live up to His standard (which is basically everyone) is thereby imperfect. So to recap, God sets the standard of what is right, and so anything else is wrong.
User avatar #53908 - thebritishguy (03/04/2014) [-]
You already have a hospital after you "die" so you don't need to kill civilians. In fact you don't have to kill anyone because omnipotence stops anyone from needing to do anything. However the real crime is the sadomasochism of eternal torture. It's like all you had to do was wait a bit for a hospital but you want the hospital early at the cost of millions of lives.

You seem to believe in some kind of objective moral standard as if there's a ruler like in Mary Poppins which can measure how good you are. However morality is just a projection or opinion, there can't be a line, there isn't something which is measurably or factually immoral. Also this is very dangerous thinking is it not? because if you mis understand Gods words or if someone misused Gods words as they have been and continue to do ever since man asked "Why?", you can justify any act. "Genocide? God want it so it's ok" "smashing babies against rocks? God wants it so it's ok" You have found a loophole to justify anything.
User avatar #53912 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
This isn't a discussion about the morality of God's actions toward humanity, it's a discussion about how we as humans respond to His actions. Say what you will about the eternal torment, but a moment ago you were only criticizing me for the way I felt about the imminent apocalypse.

See, that's one more thing you and I will have to agree to disagree on, because we as Christians believe that, yes, morality very much is black and white, and you can only be either infinitely righteous or infinitely sinful. All humans have fallen short of the perfection of God, which means all of us are infinitely sinful. "There is no one righteous, not even one." (Romans 3:10). "Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters." (Matthew 12:30). The beauty of grace, however, is that even though we've all turned against Him, through Christ, He has given us the opportunity to return to Him. So when you say that it's cruel or unjust to send billions of people to hell, remember that He offers everyone a chance to be saved. It's just a matter of choosing to accept it.
User avatar #54062 - thebritishguy (03/05/2014) [-]
You know how conversations work, it progresses and delves into different aspects of the issue. If you know you will go to heaven after you die I don't know why you want an apocalypse now, knowing that I will die as well as others.

These words are nonsense words, you can't be infinitely anything because infinite is a mathematical concept. I'm not responsible for what someone who is an ancient ancestor did. If I was then I'd be a rapist, murderer, soldier, thief etc. because there must be many of those in mine or any lineage. You know that not everyone gets a choice as a very large amount of people have never heard the gospels as they live in other cultures, epochs or just don't have Christian parents. My acceptance depends a lot on my belief on the proposition, even if I did believe though I find human sacrifice morally reprehensible and so would be reserved about accepting a human sacrifice. I don't know why the test is mainly on my ability to believe in things without evidence or reason though because if I was gullible and gave into group pressure I wouldn't be more loving or caring, but I would be destined for heaven while people like Gandhi, Malcolm X and Carl Sagan who really changed the world would be in hell.
#53787 - I think it's a general consensus among most Christians that th… 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
#53784 - Hey, idk if any of you could help me, I'm trying to remember a…  [+] (12 new replies) 03/04/2014 on Religion Board 0
User avatar #53810 - kanadetenshi (03/04/2014) [-]
"And not only this, but we also exult in our tribulations, knowing that tribulation brings about perseverance" - Romans 5:3
User avatar #53818 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Thank you, but that's not the one I'm thinking of. It's worded very closely to how I phrased it above.
User avatar #53789 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Evil to who and good to who?
User avatar #53793 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
First of all, whom*

Second of all, evil by God's standards and good by God's standards.
User avatar #53797 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
I'm making a flash animation and I can't focus on grammar.
Which God?
User avatar #53798 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Judeo-Christian.
User avatar #53800 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Well, evil was made by him to "test" people and good is made by him so that people stay on his side and if they were not on his side they go to hell if they are they get heaven. But wait, there is more. Your good old schnizy here would still take lucifers side.
User avatar #53804 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
We don't believe evil was "made" by god, we believe it is caused by anyone who defies Him, which began with Lucifer who then spread ti to humans. And regardless, that doesn't exactly help me with the verse. But thank you anyway.
User avatar #53807 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Well if you look at who killed more people you should look at Adanoi The big G . And all Lucifer wanted is to give man freedom and power.
User avatar #53812 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Bro I was just looking for a Bible verse. You wanna talk morality, we can start a new thread for that.
User avatar #53813 - schnizel (03/04/2014) [-]
Ok.
I'm gona be slow, I'm making my GIF?
User avatar #53820 - jokeface (03/04/2014) [-]
Take your time. I've got nothing going on for the next 4 hours.
#5 - These Final Destination movies are getting lazy. 03/03/2014 on Soda Beverage Upside Down +10
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#573 to #572 - jokeface ONLINE (09/02/2014) [-]
A shiny!

I shall cherish this gift forever.
#574 to #573 - tridaak (09/02/2014) [-]
Hey
Hey
User avatar #575 to #574 - jokeface ONLINE (09/02/2014) [-]
Hey
User avatar #552 - justsomechickyo (06/13/2014) [-]
yo! soooo umm I know this is really random, but what are some good verus for like hope and paitence? idk it's a long story but i'm way stressed and I know you usually have some pretty insightful ideas......thanks!
User avatar #553 to #552 - jokeface ONLINE (06/13/2014) [-]
"Blessed is the man who remains steadfast under trial, for when he has stood the test he will receive the crown of life, which God has promised to those who love him." - James 1:12

"but they who wait for the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings like eagles; they shall run and not be weary; they shall walk and not faint." - Isaiah 40:31

"Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and God of all comfort, who comforts us in all our affliction so that we will be able to comfort those who are in any affliction with the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God. For just as the sufferings of Christ are ours in abundance, so also our comfort is abundant through Christ." - II Corinthians 1:3-5

"For whatever was written in former days was written for our instruction, that through endurance and through the encouragement of the Scriptures we might have hope." - Romans 15:4

"And after you have suffered a little while, the God of all grace, who has called you to his eternal glory in Christ, will himself restore, confirm, strengthen, and establish you." - I Peter 5:10
User avatar #554 to #553 - jokeface ONLINE (06/13/2014) [-]
I could find more if you want me to.
User avatar #555 to #554 - justsomechickyo (06/14/2014) [-]
Naw this is great! Thanks so much!
User avatar #556 to #555 - jokeface ONLINE (06/14/2014) [-]
No problem, happy to be of assistance. May I ask what's troubling you, that you found yourself needing reassurance?
User avatar #557 to #556 - justsomechickyo (06/14/2014) [-]
Well my bf went to jail yesterday and I'm really bummed out about it......I waited for him while he was in prison for a long time and he's only out for r a moth then this happened......now idk wat will happen w/ him or us
User avatar #558 to #557 - jokeface ONLINE (06/14/2014) [-]
Damn. That's rough. I'm sorry that happened, and I'll certainly pray for both of you. You know, it's my firm belief that God doesn't allow bad things to happen in the world without opening doors for good things to come from them. It's definite;y distressing that this happened, but at the same time, think of it as an opportunity to grow in your strength and faithfulness. When you put your trust in Christ, He provides comfort, and He will stand by you in times of great pain. And the pain will pass. It, like everything else on Earth, is finite. But the love and grace of God is eternal. Let Him guide you through this trial, and I guarantee you'll come out stronger on the other side.
User avatar #559 to #558 - justsomechickyo (06/14/2014) [-]
Thank you so much! Ya I know it will pass and I'm trying to stay strong but it's tough......I should really be focused on myself right now anyways.....I'm trying to get sober and that's enough of a challenge in itself. I know God is here for me and I will get through this all w/ him by my side
User avatar #560 to #559 - jokeface ONLINE (06/14/2014) [-]
Here, this song might bring you some comfort/support:

Sidewalk Prophets - "The Words I Would Say" with Lyrics
User avatar #550 - thebritishguy (02/02/2014) [-]
Do you know any good theist youtubers?
User avatar #561 to #550 - jokeface ONLINE (07/17/2014) [-]
Update: I've been on Youtube a lot more than I used to be and I know a few more of the big names on there now. John Green is one of my favorites, and he's a Christian. But he's very soft-spoken about it and keeps his videos very impartial. Here's one of the only videos where he talks about religion:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXlI8Wn8J3Q
User avatar #563 to #561 - thebritishguy (07/18/2014) [-]
I met this born again rapper at college, he's not a bad rapper, although he rejects reason in favour of faith by his own volition.
soundcloud.com/panterforever
User avatar #565 to #563 - jokeface ONLINE (07/19/2014) [-]
What sort of reason does he reject?
User avatar #567 to #565 - thebritishguy (07/19/2014) [-]
Just the principles in philosophy like logic, he says that if people study philosophy, science and reason then they will turn away from God. So you must fear reason and logic as God is illogical and unreasonable. It's strange how much I agreed with him. I was dumbfounded.
User avatar #569 to #567 - jokeface ONLINE (07/19/2014) [-]
Yea see, that's where I draw the line. I don't believe that reason and faith automatically have to oppose each other. I believe that sometimes they do, but I don't think it's always the case. As I've said before, most science I find very reliable and even necessary to human existence. Without science we wouldn't have most medicines and technology that allows us to live our everyday lives. The Christians who reject all science give us a bad name. They don't realize that they are the product of science. Maybe not physiologically, but psychologically, they grew up in a world that was shaped by it. They depend on it even without realizing it.
User avatar #570 to #569 - thebritishguy (07/19/2014) [-]
I just held up my phone and said
"This was built on the basis of scientific principles and theories, if science has no value and is innacurate, if the theories are just guesses and the scientists were deluded, it should not work"
Then I turned it on, at that point though he just caved in and said he was not interested in debating and whatever I say will not change his mind, so there was no point in it.

I think it's because a lot of people think it is either science or God when this is of course not the case. I consider faith to be apart from reason though because it is elementary that what can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.
User avatar #571 to #570 - jokeface ONLINE (07/19/2014) [-]
And you have every right to feel that way. I completely understand that mindset.
User avatar #562 to #561 - thebritishguy (07/18/2014) [-]
He's incredibly vague, he never really answered the question
User avatar #564 to #562 - jokeface ONLINE (07/19/2014) [-]
Agreed, but he does that intentionally. As he said, the way people handle religion on the internet is very sloppy, and my guess is he feels that if he expressed his religious views outwardly, he would appear narrow-minded and bigoted, and he is very much NOT that. In fact, I've only ever heard him admit to being a Christian once, maybe twice, in all of his videos that I've seen. He doesn't ever say anything preachy, ever, and he doesn't let his faith define his character. So really, it wouldn't matter what his beliefs were, he'd still be the same person.
User avatar #566 to #564 - thebritishguy (07/19/2014) [-]
I'll check out more of his videos tommorow. It doesn't seem like he is taking a cut throat rationalist aproach though but more of an emotional appeal.
User avatar #568 to #566 - jokeface ONLINE (07/19/2014) [-]
That's what I thought too, and I don't like when people do that, but I understand why they do it. And considering that so many of his videos are educational, and the fact that he and his brother also host a second channel specifically for academic learning (called CrashCourse in case you're interested), it makes sense that he's trying to reach as many people as possible, and quite frankly, he doesn't actually need to have a particular religious stance in order to be that kind of YouTuber.
User avatar #551 to #550 - jokeface ONLINE (02/03/2014) [-]
I don't really know any Youtubers, let alone theist ones. The only one I really like is TomSka, and I don't know what he believes.
User avatar #548 - thebritishguy (01/04/2014) [-]
I don't know what this means
"'He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters. Therefore I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. And whoever says a word against the Son of man will be forgiven; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come" (Matthew 12:22-32).

So what actually is this unforgivable sin please?
#546 - snood (12/20/2013) [-]
Hey i just read a lot of your comments about Christianity. You're one of the good ones on here, at least from what i saw. Keep it up.
User avatar #547 to #546 - jokeface ONLINE (12/20/2013) [-]
Thank you. I try to be good.
#541 - thebritishguy (07/22/2013) [-]
What do you think about Zimmerman? I think he was innocent, he just pulled a family out of a burning SUV!
User avatar #542 to #541 - jokeface ONLINE (07/22/2013) [-]
I have mixed feelings about Zimmerman. On the one hand I don't support killing people, even in self defense. But on the other hand, I believe his testimony and understand why he shot the kid. If it had been me, and I was being attacked, I might have shot him, but not fatally. I would have tried to shoot his leg or something to just injure him so that I could gain control of the situation. But ultimately, from a legal standpoint and not a religious one, I consider him innocent.
#543 to #542 - thebritishguy (07/23/2013) [-]
From what the evidence shows I would have shot him but many people doubt the evidence. The way the media portrayed him was really silly I thought, he had several reasons why he was suspicious of Trayvon, it was raining and he was wandering around leisurely staring at houses, there were recent break ins in the area and the particular house Treyvon was looking at had been left unlocked on previous occasions. Yet the media insists that race is the sole reason Zimmerman not only was suspicious of Trayvon, but even why he shot him.
User avatar #544 to #543 - jokeface ONLINE (07/23/2013) [-]
Yea I really don't think race had anything to do with it.
#537 - anonymous (06/09/2013) [-]
www.youtube.com/watch?v=s6wWQgGTAlk
is this you? I assume you made that slinky video so therefore this guy would have to be you
User avatar #538 to #537 - jokeface ONLINE (06/09/2013) [-]
I didn't make the slinky video, I just found it and thought it was cool. And no, that's not me. Number one I don't have access to giant shellfish, and number two I wouldn't be caught dead without my trilby hat.
User avatar #535 - josieabby (04/13/2013) [-]
I just wanted you to know that your "Thrift Shop" thread with taxation was one of the most epic things I've ever seen. I put the song on so I could sing your lyrics over it. I'm gonna have a perma-grin for at least a week!
User avatar #536 to #535 - jokeface ONLINE (04/13/2013) [-]
Haha, thank you. I'm glad you liked it. I just wish we could have done the entire song. But I ran out of ideas lol.
#502 - thebritishguy (03/24/2013) [-]
what do you think about atheist church's? there's one in England they just give science lectures, sing pop songs and comedians come on. I'd love to go
User avatar #503 to #502 - jokeface ONLINE (03/24/2013) [-]
Sounds awesome. Of course, I wouldn't agree with them denouncing the belief in God, but other than that it sounds like it'd be fun. Why do they call it a church though?
User avatar #504 to #503 - thebritishguy (03/24/2013) [-]
I think it is just that there aren't really any other names for that sort of thing
The word church originally just meant a meeting place but I get what you mean
#496 - necessary **User deleted account** has deleted their comment [-]
User avatar #497 to #496 - jokeface ONLINE (03/24/2013) [-]
She was supposed to come up a few weeks ago but she never did. And I finally got fed up with not being able to see her, and so I put our relationship on hold until she comes up here. I'd go down to see her myself but I live on my own now and have a bunch of expenses that prevent me from being able to.
#498 to #497 - necessary **User deleted account** has deleted their comment [-]
User avatar #499 to #498 - jokeface ONLINE (03/24/2013) [-]
Yea.
#473 - thebritishguy (03/17/2013) [-]
Are you worried about North Korea?
User avatar #479 to #473 - jingleforth (03/18/2013) [-]
Lmao, north korea is not a threat.
User avatar #482 to #479 - thebritishguy (03/18/2013) [-]
well China and Russia are and they have relations also the citizens of North Korea will be screwed
User avatar #483 to #482 - jingleforth (03/18/2013) [-]
Yes they do, but I've told you. If north korea attacks us, they lose support, and if such an event happened. They'd turn into a nuclear crater.
User avatar #484 to #483 - thebritishguy (03/18/2013) [-]
I suppose, it's still sad for all the poor North Koreans
User avatar #485 to #484 - jingleforth (03/18/2013) [-]
Oh well.

User avatar #474 to #473 - jokeface ONLINE (03/17/2013) [-]
Define "worried".
#475 to #474 - thebritishguy (03/17/2013) [-]
uuum like scared that world war 3 will begin or the civilians of North Korea will be nuked like Hiroshima , they have connections with Russia and China and have the fourth biggest military, Kim Jong Un told his troops to prepare for war and they always do nuclear weapon testing. On the other hand South Korea thinks they are just trying to get attention and trying to look big.
User avatar #476 to #475 - jokeface ONLINE (03/17/2013) [-]
And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not alarmed, for this must take place, but the end is not yet. For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom, and there will be famines and earthquakes in various places. - Matthew 24:6-7

I'm a little nervous of how it might affect people on a personal level, yes. But I know it's coming and I've accepted that fact, because as Jesus said, the end is not yet.
User avatar #480 to #476 - jingleforth (03/18/2013) [-]
Lmao, taking the bible seriously.

Gee, Jaime, you get into unusual stuff.
User avatar #486 to #480 - jokeface ONLINE (03/18/2013) [-]
I'm afraid I don't get that reference.
User avatar #487 to #486 - jingleforth (03/18/2013) [-]
You're Christian/Catholic/Whatever.

Laughable. Possibly..
User avatar #489 to #487 - jokeface ONLINE (03/18/2013) [-]
Why is it laughable? Or, to be more specific, why am I more laughable than other Christians?
User avatar #490 to #489 - jingleforth (03/18/2013) [-]
I find all Christians laughable on an equal level.

However, evolutionary theists have a special place in my colon.
User avatar #491 to #490 - jokeface ONLINE (03/18/2013) [-]
And why is that?
User avatar #492 to #491 - jingleforth (03/18/2013) [-]
They're naturally trained to ******** their way through an argument.

No matter what you say, it somehow fits in with science, or it's metaphorical, just...something to at the very least neutralize the argument given to them.
User avatar #477 to #476 - thebritishguy (03/17/2013) [-]
hmmm this supports my psycho analysis of the God delusion.
"When people make decisions they use their Ego to decide what to do, the ego is where morality comes from and is sometimes called the "soul" according to Frued. When people base their morality and decisions based on what they think a God says the God becomes the ego. This is supported by the fact people ignore/highlight certain verses and lessons if they agree/disagree with them rather than getting a true perspective of the characters to keep the character as their ego rather than having to separate God from ego. It is also supported by people using words like "reject" and why religious people are so protective of their Gods and are personally insulted when people criticise their Gods. Also the emotions they feel when some theists talk to atheists are similar to those of rejection, when an atheist doesn't believe in God they are not rejecting the proposed God and yet they use that word, it seems to me that they use the word reject because they feel they are being rejected"
User avatar #478 to #477 - jokeface ONLINE (03/18/2013) [-]
Quite insightful. However allow me to make a few counterarguments.

From the perspective of someone who believes God exists as described in the Bible, consider that such a being would indeed have dominion over morality and, yes, even the ego of those who choose to submit to Him. That being said, can you really blame us for it?

As for your point about verses, understand that I don't ignore any of the Bible. At most, I don't apply the laws that Jesus and Paul said are no longer relevant. It's like studying slavery. We don't have slaves anymore, but that doesn't stop us from learning about the slavery that existed years and years ago. In the same way, some parts of the Bible, such as Mosaic Law, are now obsolete, but that doesn't stop us from learning about it.

Lastly, I don't think that's entirely why theists react the way they do to atheists. Because that would imply that theists view atheists as the "popular kids" and they feel excluded from them. Such is not the case. I mean, that might be said for some people, but speaking for myself and many others, being a theist among atheists is more like being in a special club with amazing benefits, and you can invite as many people as you want, but nobody else wants to join. And it hurts, yes, but not because we feel rejected; Rather, we're simply disappointed that no one else wants to share in our joy.
#481 to #478 - thebritishguy (03/18/2013) [-]
so then why would God make the morality so different? all of our morals are different and change over time, if I was born in the 60's I would probably have different morals than I do now, if I was born in Afghanistan I would have different morals, therefore morality must be something we learn to an extent (we all share common morals like murder, lying and stealing is wrong) rather than God given and also this would intrude on free will. When you think of God I'm sure you don't think about when he ordered the deaths of millions of people or the time he sent bears to kill children for making fun of a bald guy but you pay attention to all the nice verses or like how you ignore the part in the bible were Jesus said to give away all your money or that for some odd reason God dislikes ordinary things that you probably do every day.
I'm not implying theists desperately want atheists to like them I'm saying that when I say "God is a dictator" people start saying I personally attacked them when I didn't
User avatar #488 to #481 - jokeface ONLINE (03/18/2013) [-]
What you say about common morals is true, and those are the ones which I believe God instills in us. But it's not an intrusion on free will because the morality God gives us is just instinct, and we have the freedom to either give in or resist that instinct. And I do think about everything in the Bible (or at least, everything I can remember, since I haven't been able to memorize all of it). I know God did some crazy **** in the past, but that doesn't take away from the importance of His words now. We don't ignore any of it. Or at least, the Christians I know don't ignore any of it. I'm sure there are some who do but I don't condone it. God gave us the entire Bible so that we could learn from the entire Bible.
User avatar #493 to #488 - thebritishguy (03/18/2013) [-]
I would have thought your morals would have come from the bible as you don't think sex before marriage is good for instance. Well I have never heard about all the horrible and contradictory things in the bible at Sunday school or in church I only heard about the nice (well they cartooned it to make it seem nice) stuff and how God was great. Never heard about the rape, incest, slavery, stoning, homophobia, sexism etc. until I became and atheist. do you know how the bible was written?
User avatar #494 to #493 - jokeface ONLINE (03/18/2013) [-]
Some of it. I know the first five books (called the Pentateuch) were written by Moses. I don't remember who write the rest of the Old Testament. The Four Gospels were written by their namesakes: Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John the Apostle. Acts was written by Luke, and Paul wrote the 21 Epistles. And Revelation was written by John the Apostle. It was completed almost 150 years after Jesus' death (about AD 150).
User avatar #495 to #494 - thebritishguy (03/18/2013) [-]
They are the scriptures. The first Christians needed a book to read to their people so they all met up and have a long conversation about which books to add and which ones to exclude based on what they wanted to teach. The first Christians already burnt a few scriptures which are amusing (there was one were Jesus tamed dragons) but they complied them together and then gave them to really good authors to edit so that they all fit together. there's a documentary on it
http://www(.)youtube(.)com/watch?v=phyN5tWUIUI
User avatar #463 - ragnarfag (03/14/2013) [-]
It seems Thebritishguy is quite intrusive on your profil, would you consider as him a friend or as more of a rivle?
User avatar #465 to #463 - jokeface ONLINE (03/15/2013) [-]
He is what I call a "lost one". I feel no enmity toward him, but rather sadness at his adamant stance against the faith. However, he seems intelligent and his debate style is intellectually stimulating, so I imagine he would be fun to talk to about other issues, even if we disagree on those as well.
#464 to #463 - anonymous (03/15/2013) [-]
thebritishguy is a troll
User avatar #466 to #464 - jokeface ONLINE (03/15/2013) [-]
Why would an anon come to my page? I suspect you are Thebritishguy, having been summoned by the calling of your name, and you replied to it as an anon. If that is the case, your "trolling" efforts are uninspiring.
User avatar #468 to #466 - thebritishguy (03/15/2013) [-]
I'm not sure how to prove that he is not me but...he's not me
#469 to #468 - anonymous (03/15/2013) [-]
what are you talking about? you're definitely me
User avatar #470 to #469 - thebritishguy (03/15/2013) [-]
if you were me why would you reply to my comment, unless it was me and this was a double bluff, but if it was a double bluff I would not mention it is a double bluff because I'd want you to fall for it
#471 to #470 - anonymous (03/16/2013) [-]
lol jk. it really is me, thebritishguy. i'd like to admit that i'm only an atheist because i was molested
User avatar #472 to #471 - thebritishguy (03/16/2013) [-]
see it's not me...unless this was a triple bluff FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU
#467 to #466 - anonymous (03/15/2013) [-]
man, you got me all figured out...
User avatar #427 - thebritishguy (03/11/2013) [-]
I am more moral than God, I believe no one deserves to be burnt alive for eternity, slavery is wrong, we should all be treated equal, witches don't...wait witches don't even exist, I'm not homophobic , I am against genocide, I don't demand constant worship, I don't threaten people so they agree with me. Surely you are also more moral than God?
User avatar #532 to #427 - jokeface ONLINE (03/25/2013) [-]
To say God is anything less than perfect is to say that He doesn't meet the "proper" standards of decency. And if that's the case, then I have to ask, who has set the proper standards? Certainly no human. We're all flawed. So who are we to decide what's right or wrong? God is without flaw because there is no one to set standards for Him. Therefore only He can set standards, and if He is the standard, then anyone who doesn't match Him is wrong. Ergo, He is perfect.
#533 to #532 - thebritishguy (03/25/2013) [-]
God is perfect?
User avatar #534 to #533 - jokeface ONLINE (03/25/2013) [-]
God is above the laws He sets for humanity. He is not bound to follow them, and even so, they can't really be applied to His actions for certain reasons.

Godly wrath is not the same as the sinful wrath, because He has every right to bring judgment upon us. As I said, He's perfect, so his wrath is justified, whereas ours is hypocritical.

The reason He doesn't want us to worship other gods is because He knows they are not real and therefore our worship of them is wasteful, as well as disrespectful to Him, the one true God whom we should be worshiping.

God was never idle, except for on the last day of the week of Creation, and it wasn't because He was tired or lazy, it was because He was setting a model for all of humanity to live by.

People do not hunger because God deprives them, but because we do. As agents of Christ we are called to help our fellow man, and if people starve because we fail to feed them, that's on us, not God. It's one of the duties we accepted when we chose to fall away from Him.

Once again, being perfect, He has every right to advertise Himself as such and demand people to worship. When He condemns humans for being prideful it's because we don't have anything to be proud of by His standards. Maybe by our own, but since we're not the standard, our own self-satisfaction doesn't count as praise-worthy.

God commands us to give to the poor and needy, not to Him. That is not greed.

He is not lustful, either. Lust would mean He gets sexually aroused, which He doesn't. I think whoever made this list just got to lust and couldn't think of anything so they just threw that one in their without much thought.
User avatar #430 to #427 - jokeface ONLINE (03/12/2013) [-]
God never condoned slavery, "witches" in the Bible are referring to people like Wiccans and others who practice magic (that is, magic that is taken seriously, not magic tricks), God doesn't fear anyone or anything so He cannot be homophobic, and frankly it doesn't matter what your personal opinions are because just because you disagree doesn't make you right. God's word is infallible and His doctrines are perfect. No human can ever be more moral than God. Hell, no human can ever be as moral as God.
#431 to #430 - thebritishguy (03/12/2013) [-]
The bible never says anything about it not being real which is kind of ******* important seeing as millions of innocent people were killed because they were "witches". You know that homophobic doesn't mean scared lol it means you hate gay people. If you think it is perfect then go burn a witch! oh no wait you aren't going to do that you are going to ignore it like all the rest of the bible, if you thought it was perfect you would live by it, you would sell your computer and give the money to charity like Jesus said.
User avatar #539 to #431 - teoberry (07/11/2013) [-]
Homophobic

Phobic - one who has a fear of something (adjc. of phobia)

Phobia - a fear of something

Jeez British, lrn2english
User avatar #540 to #539 - thebritishguy (07/11/2013) [-]
faggot
noun [C usually plural] (WOOD) (US also fagot)
/ˈfæɡ.ət/ old-fashioned
Definition
› sticks of wood, tied together and used as fuel for a fire

hmmm I guess when people say faggot on the internet they are talking about bundles of sticks.
You know as well as I do that homophobes aren't simply terryfied of gay people, it also means if they have contempt towards homosexuals, particularly in this culture.
User avatar #432 to #431 - jokeface ONLINE (03/12/2013) [-]
Obviously it can't be talking about real witches since humans can't do magic unless God gives them powers, and the only people He gave powers to were the Disciples.

And God doesn't hate gay people, He loves everyone.

And we're not ignoring the Bible, in fact, paying closer attention to it is exactly why we don't follow Mosaic Law. Because Jesus and Paul both clarified that it wasn't required after the Crucifixion.
User avatar #433 to #432 - thebritishguy (03/12/2013) [-]
Jesus also said to sell everything and give it to the poor and a rich man can't get into heaven. the question is whether God is a moral person, he said homosexual acts are an abomination and you should kill them. If the writers of the bible didn't believe in witches why the **** didn't they say they didn't exist and it wasn't real? instead they had loads of rules on witchcraft, it's not like there was a word limit. don't be the interpreter
www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mLOUWl-L-s
User avatar #458 to #433 - jokeface ONLINE (03/13/2013) [-]
God didn't adopt the attitudes of men, men adopted the attitudes of God.

And it doesn't matter if God is benevolent or not, because it doesn't change the way the system works. We worship Jesus so we can go to heaven, or else we go to hell. That's a fact, regardless of whether or not God appeals to your personal preferences.

And yes, I know you don't believe in Him anyway, but for the sake of argument, let's say God revealed Himself to everyone, to the point where He could not be denied by anyone, and He confirmed to us that everything in the Bible is an accurate depiction of both Him and the afterlife. Are you going to sit there and tell me that you would accept eternity in hell just because God doesn't base all His decisions around what you think they should be?
User avatar #461 to #458 - thebritishguy (03/13/2013) [-]
******** , guys had those attitudes before the bible was written, your God is similar to many other Gods in mythology, if God revealed himslef I would worship him out of blind fear I guess but that's not going to happen
User avatar #462 to #461 - jokeface ONLINE (03/14/2013) [-]
I'm sure they did have those attitudes before the Bible was written, but what I'm saying is, the authors that wrote those things in the Bible only wrote them because God told them to. It doesn't matter what their personal feelings were, even if they agreed with them. That wasn't their motive. And if you admit that you would worship God out of blind fear then how can you judge us for doing the same?
User avatar #500 to #462 - thebritishguy (03/24/2013) [-]
I wouldn't say it was blind fear why Christians worship God, but there is barely any evidence for God. What I'm saying is do you think it's a coincidence that a benevolent and just God had the same attitudes as the homophobic slave owners of thousands of years ago? If he is real then those homophobic slave owners were perfect and should carry on ******* slaves. However it is really obvious that it was those people who wrote the book so they could justify having sex and beating their slaves among other things
User avatar #505 to #500 - jokeface ONLINE (03/24/2013) [-]
God never said we should have slaves, and neither did the Bible. The most we're told about slaves is that if you are a slave, you should be kind and obedient to your master, because violent rebellion would be sinful. That's a commandment for the slave, not the slave owner.
#506 to #505 - thebritishguy (03/24/2013) [-]
just ignore the Old Testament why don't you
When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-21 NAB)
I would argue religion is slavery as shown in this picture
User avatar #507 to #506 - jokeface ONLINE (03/24/2013) [-]
Mosaic Law only applied to specific groups of Israelites at the time they were given. They became overruled when Jesus died.

And that picture is beautiful. I'm not even kidding. I'm inspired by it.
User avatar #508 to #507 - thebritishguy (03/25/2013) [-]
stock·holm syn·drome
Noun
Feelings of trust or affection felt in many cases of kidnapping or hostage-taking by a victim toward a captor.
regardless of whether you follow it or not it is written in the bible and supposedly said by your God, my point still stands. Also the New Testament never says that slavery is wrong it says slaves should be good so it is on the side of the slave masters
User avatar #509 to #508 - jokeface ONLINE (03/25/2013) [-]
Yea, there's a lot of names that make it sound bad, but the fact is that we're perfectly adjusted and functional, so there's nothing wrong with having faith. Submission to God has no negative impacts on a person's life. All it does is ensure our place in heaven after we die.
User avatar #511 to #509 - thebritishguy (03/25/2013) [-]
it had a bad impact on my life, I used to cry because I thought millions of people will be or are burning in hell, I find it quite bizarre that no body else seems to care. I used to feel guilty for doing normal things like fapping. Stockholm syndrome originated when hostages defended their captor. Their reasoning was that he was good because he didn't kill or beat them and they loved him because he didn't abuse them physically, this is very similar to religion.
User avatar #515 to #511 - jokeface ONLINE (03/25/2013) [-]
I don't know what you mean by "nobody else seems to care." As Christians we care a great deal about the dangers of hell and naturally we aim to save as many people as possible from it. As for fapping, the Bible doesn't actually say anything about it. A lot of people like to reference some quote about it being better for your seed to fall into the belly of a whore than on the ground, but that's never mentioned in the Bible. As for the Stockholm Syndrome, I understand the connection your making, but the difference is that in that situation the kidnapper has done something bad by kidnapping the person. God's done nothing wrong to us. He's only done good and perfect things. He's not a villain, He's a hero.
#516 to #515 - thebritishguy (03/25/2013) [-]
did you just skip the entire old testament? just the simple fact that you believe he will burn me alive for eternity should be enough to say he is a cunt Jesus ******* Christ
User avatar #521 to #516 - jokeface ONLINE (03/25/2013) [-]
Why does that make Him a cunt? He's a just God. Everything He does is perfect. All human beings deserve to burn for eternity because we all have wickedness in our hearts. But He has offered us salvation in spite of that, and that makes Him benevolent.
#529 to #521 - thebritishguy (03/25/2013) [-]
so when I burn alive it is justice? you ass hole! you need to get therapy for your severe Stockholm syndrome. It is like Jesus is your abusive boyfriend and he has told you that you are a piece of **** and worthless and disgusting but if you love him you are good. It is the same tactics abusive partners use to manipulate and control people
User avatar #530 to #529 - jokeface ONLINE (03/25/2013) [-]
You keep saying that, but I don't get what you think I should do about it. How is it helpful for you to inform me of this similarity?
User avatar #531 to #530 - thebritishguy (03/25/2013) [-]
I just want you to realise common tactics religions use to control people and that your God isn't a cool dude he is a controlling dictator. come on man if someone sends people to burn and be tortured for eternity and you think they're perfect something is wrong with you
User avatar #510 to #509 - jingleforth (03/25/2013) [-]
"There's nothing wrong with faith."

Sure, but it goes against the scientific nature of humans.

Our society exists on the structure of scientific discoveries, which is the exact opposite of faith. Faith is "idunoo lol, but i believe in it" while science takes a more reasonable approach forming extremely good hypothesis', testing them, making sure everything fits right.

I'm not saying your belief is completely wrong, I'm just saying it has absolutely no value to society in our era..
User avatar #523 to #510 - jokeface ONLINE (03/25/2013) [-]
I'm not saying the Bible doesn't have graphic and frightening things in it, because it does. I'm saying that the things we're supposed to be doing (covered thoroughly in the New Testament) are all good. Most of the violence and objectionable stuff is in the Old Testament, but we're not supposed to be doing that stuff.
User avatar #524 to #523 - jingleforth (03/25/2013) [-]
The new testament is still quite graphic, not to mention God in the old testament was a pretty huge dick, as well. He was extremely EXTREMELY malevolent then.
User avatar #525 to #524 - jokeface ONLINE (03/25/2013) [-]
No, He was extremely just back then.
User avatar #526 to #525 - jingleforth (03/25/2013) [-]
You're either a troll, or a really moronic human. Guessing both.
User avatar #527 to #526 - jokeface ONLINE (03/25/2013) [-]
Neither. God gave us very simple commandments, and we continually choose to disobey Him. Why would we deserve His love or grace? We don't. It's a gift. The most amazing gift we could ever hope for. That makes Him benevolent.
User avatar #528 to #527 - jingleforth (03/25/2013) [-]
lol
User avatar #512 to #510 - jokeface ONLINE (03/25/2013) [-]
I didn't say it was in line with scientific nature, I just said it only has positive consequences.
User avatar #513 to #512 - jingleforth (03/25/2013) [-]
Considering I was never truly apart of this conversation...What positive aspects other than some sort of denialistic stuff?
User avatar #514 to #513 - jokeface ONLINE (03/25/2013) [-]
It grants us access to heaven, which gives us hope and peace of mind until we die. Also the Bible is full of good morals and lessons on how to be a better person.
User avatar #517 to #514 - jingleforth (03/25/2013) [-]
1. To a place that you don't know exists, okay..
2. I said without denialsm..
3. lol, no.
User avatar #520 to #517 - jokeface ONLINE (03/25/2013) [-]
1. I trust the testimonials of all the people who claim to have seen heaven when they had near-death experiences.
2. What denialism? I'm not denying anything.
3. No what? What are you referring to?
User avatar #522 to #520 - jingleforth (03/25/2013) [-]
1. Near-death experiences have easily been explained, not to mention people in those times had no scientific knowledge. That's why the Greeks thought earthquakes were caused by a guy shaking his head..
2. Not explaining, too much trouble.
3. The bible has tons of immoral stuff in it. Now, you can easily ******** your way through it and ignore the fact it's got a ton of disgusting stuff in it and claim all it's goodness even though I could ******* do it to just about any piece of literature..
#459 to #458 - say (03/13/2013) [-]
Imma christian, and I say just be a good person and serve your brothers (be a nice guy) whenever you have the option to be a dick instead, do what's right and you're good.

Also you gotta remember, the book was written by a bunch of old guys 2000+ years ago. they were wise, very, very, wise, but they lived in a time period where certain things that should be acceptable today weren't back then due to man made culture and beliefs, not god based, like being gay.
#501 to #459 - thebritishguy (03/24/2013) [-]
but why did your God agree with the people who wrote the book?
#545 to #501 - say (09/04/2013) [-]
who ever said he did?
User avatar #460 to #459 - jokeface ONLINE (03/13/2013) [-]
I agree with loving your brother and refraining from being a dick, yes. That's something Jesus said was very important. But He said loving Him was just as important, if not more so.

And also, remember that those men were directly inspired by God. He put the words in their hearts and commanded them to write them down. Aside form the outdated Mosaic Law, there weren't really any commandments that lost their relevance. The only one I can think of is the one about women teaching. I researched that one and yes that one was relevant to both the current time period as well as the current place Paul was was speaking to. For reference, I invite you to go to this link:
http://godswordtowomen.org/fees.htm
...and Ctrl+F the phrase: "Scripture is Finally Explained". Those couple paragraphs give a very clear and insightful meaning of the verse.
User avatar #434 to #433 - jokeface ONLINE (03/12/2013) [-]
Jesus told one man to sell everything he had to follow Him. He wasn't saying every human should sell everything they own. And nowhere in the Bible are we commanded to kill homosexuals. All it says is that they shall be put to death. It doesn't say we are the ones who should put them to death. It means God will kill their souls. And we know this is the case because Jesus said not to kill anyone, and killing the gays would contradict this. So death of the spirit is the only possible way to interpret it.
User avatar #435 to #434 - thebritishguy (03/12/2013) [-]
yes, killing the gays contradicts it, there are loads of contradictions in the bible, it says to kill loads of different people, I think we have had this conversation before it never says anything about the soul your just making **** up it also says that their blood shall be upon them but if God was taking their soul there would be no blood. He said a rich man won't enter heaven and he says on a number of occasions to sell your stuff and give to the poor, did you watch the video?
User avatar #437 to #435 - jokeface ONLINE (03/12/2013) [-]
Okay, I watched it. I'll concede to the thing about selling your possessions, but I still don't think He meant literally. Remember when He went into the temple and got angry at the people who were buying and selling there, and He started flipping tables and **** ? I think if He really wanted us to literally sell all our possessions, then He would be flipping tables every place He went. He'd always be scrutinizing people for owning things. No, what I think He means is to not let the possessions become more important than your loyalty to Him. That is, don't sell them from your ownership, but rather sell them from your heart. Let go of them spiritually, so that they don't prevent you from following Him.

The other part of the video I'll address is the thing about abolishing the old laws. Let me break it down for you:

Jesus said "I have not come to abolish [the old laws] but to fulfill them." What He means is that His arrival on Earth does not cancel or nullify the laws. They're still in place even though He has arrived, and because he is the Son of God, only He can fulfill them, because man is imperfect and can never fulfill the law. However, He goes on to say that nothing about the laws will change "until all is accomplished." What do you think He's referring to? I'll give you a hint: What did He come to Earth to do besides fulfill the law? He came to die. And right before He breathed His last breath, His last words were: "It is finished." That was it. That was Him declaring that the old law was obsolete and the new law would begin.

Then later in Galatians, the Apostle Paul write about how violation of the law no longer condemns us because Christ died to sanctify us in spite of sin: "[We] know that a person is not justified by the works of the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law, because by the works of the law no one will be justified...I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!"
User avatar #438 to #437 - thebritishguy (03/12/2013) [-]
but God still told people to commit mass genocides and kill loads of innocent people, he's a cunt
User avatar #439 to #438 - jokeface ONLINE (03/12/2013) [-]
I really don't care what He said to do in the Old Testament. We don't worship Him because we agree with Him. We worship Him because He is the only one who can save us from hell. And that's infinitely more important than anything that happens on Earth.
User avatar #441 to #439 - thebritishguy (03/12/2013) [-]
wouldn't you go to hell just for saying/thinking that? the thought police are on you now
User avatar #442 to #441 - jokeface ONLINE (03/12/2013) [-]
No, because that's exactly what Jesus told us to think. Every time He told us to have faith in Him, He said it was because only through Him would we enter heaven.
User avatar #443 to #442 - thebritishguy (03/12/2013) [-]
he didn't say "ignore My Dad he's a dick" though
User avatar #444 to #443 - jokeface ONLINE (03/12/2013) [-]
No, but He did say that we weren't bound by the laws His dad had previously set.
#445 to #444 - thebritishguy (03/12/2013) [-]
this reminds me of this, the way I see it the Christians wanted to separate themselves from the Jews so that's why they had Jesus saying these things, you still believe Gid is an asshole though right?
User avatar #446 to #445 - jokeface ONLINE (03/12/2013) [-]
I never believed God was an asshole. And the Christians didn't want to separate themselves from the Jews. The first Christians were Jews themselves. They just wanted everyone to worship Jesus with them. Read Galatians 2. It sheds some light on that issue.
User avatar #448 to #446 - thebritishguy (03/12/2013) [-]
most Jews don't believe Jesus was a prophet also I think it was like 98% of jews just thought he was a hippie
User avatar #450 to #448 - jokeface ONLINE (03/12/2013) [-]
I know that Jews and Christians are very different now, but I'm saying when Christianity first began, that wasn't as much the case. Again, the first Christians were Jews.
User avatar #452 to #450 - thebritishguy (03/12/2013) [-]
I saw a documentary about it, I think they wanted to make it clear that they were different from the Jews so that's why they had certain elements, don't you think it's a coincidence that your God had the same attitudes towards thing like homosexuality and women as the people who wrote the bible?
User avatar #454 to #452 - jokeface ONLINE (03/12/2013) [-]
I don't understand. Why would it be a coincidence?
User avatar #455 to #454 - thebritishguy (03/12/2013) [-]
exactly, if an omniscient and benevolent God wrote it why would he have the same attitudes as 2000 year old dessert dwellers
User avatar #447 to #446 - thebritishguy (03/12/2013) [-]
this in the belief that your God is going to burn me alive, if someone was going to burn you alive I wouldn't love them I would hate them
User avatar #449 to #447 - jokeface ONLINE (03/12/2013) [-]
Well that's a shame.
User avatar #451 to #449 - thebritishguy (03/12/2013) [-]
it isn't a shame it is sane, why would anyone believe another human deserves to go to hell? even Hitler only deserves to go there for a day or two and then he can go back to sleep
#457 to #451 - anonymous (03/13/2013) [-]
for the love of God, stop being a faggot. You're not even listening to anything he's saying.
User avatar #453 to #451 - jokeface ONLINE (03/12/2013) [-]
Everyone deserves eternity in hell because everyone has turned away from God. It doesn't matter what's "sane" by your standards. God made a decision. There's no questioning it, no challenging it, no arguing it. We follow Him or we go to hell. That's it. There's nothing to discuss. Just decide if you prefer heaven or hell. It's simple.
User avatar #456 to #453 - thebritishguy (03/12/2013) [-]
no it's grotesque and dictatorial he is not benevolent or just he is the most evil character in all of history, you know I don't believe it is true
User avatar #440 to #439 - thebritishguy (03/12/2013) [-]
out of fear, like how they worship Kim Jong Un in North Korea
User avatar #436 to #435 - jokeface ONLINE (03/12/2013) [-]
I'll watch it later, I'm on the phone right now. But anyway, I know there are parts of the Bible where it says to kill people but those parts are in the Mosaic Law and don't apply anymore. I can provide sources explaining why.
#428 to #427 - anonymous (03/11/2013) [-]
oh shut up troll
User avatar #429 to #428 - thebritishguy (03/11/2013) [-]
no anon I am not even trolling
#387 - thebritishguy (03/04/2013) [-]
I might become a Buddhist, I don't know I have been reading a book on it and it seems pretty cool, but I won't believe in re incarnation. Pastafarianism was fun for a while but I seem to be losing faith in a carbohydrate based deity...I can't feel his noodley appendages holding me down anymore R'Amen
User avatar #388 to #387 - jokeface ONLINE (03/04/2013) [-]
Buddhism is an admirable philosophy but it deceives you about the afterlife and the true God. It would be good to apply some of its principles to a Christian lifestyle (such as letting go of desire, being nonviolent, etc.) but any belief that does not focus on Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior is wrong and will lead to suffering.
#393 to #388 - thebritishguy (03/04/2013) [-]
like the belief in Jesus has not caused suffering, Buddhism has no God you don't worship anyone but some cultures have there own separate Gods which they include into Buddhism. The statement that believing in any other religion will cause suffering is frankly wrong and nothing more than an idea supported by your opinion.
User avatar #394 to #393 - jokeface ONLINE (03/05/2013) [-]
I wasn't talking about suffering in this life. I was referring to hell.
#398 to #394 - thebritishguy (03/05/2013) [-]
all these people will go to hell because they were born into the "wrong" families, your God is an ass
User avatar #400 to #398 - jokeface ONLINE (03/05/2013) [-]
No, they'll go to hell because we are asses for depriving them of the truth. It's our job to save them.
User avatar #401 to #400 - thebritishguy (03/05/2013) [-]
you don't know or even have any evidence what you say is the truth, if you were born in India you would be saying the same thing about there God, if you were born in Afghanistan you would be saying the same thing about Allah, religion isn't innate it is geographic
User avatar #404 to #401 - jokeface ONLINE (03/05/2013) [-]
We have evidence but apparently it's not good enough for you.
User avatar #406 to #404 - thebritishguy (03/05/2013) [-]
no, the reasoning you use to explain God and the bible isn't good enough (hows your girlfriend btw?)
User avatar #409 to #406 - jokeface ONLINE (03/05/2013) [-]
Things are hard right now. She couldn't make it up to visit as scheduled, and then two days later her father passed away. So it's tough.
User avatar #410 to #409 - thebritishguy (03/05/2013) [-]
hmmmmmm have you heard of the show cat fish? maybe she is a he, have you spoken to...her..on webcam?
User avatar #412 to #410 - jokeface ONLINE (03/05/2013) [-]
I've heard of the show but I haven't watched it. However I did see the movie so I know what it's about. Coincidentally, the main guy in that movie looks so much like me it's eerie. And no, we haven't webcammed, but we've spoken on the phone so I at least know she's a girl. She also has videos of herself on Facebook, so I can match the voice to the face in the pictures.
User avatar #414 to #412 - thebritishguy (03/05/2013) [-]
the guy in the film looks pretty cool, maybe you could say to hold up a piece of paper with your name on it and take a photo to be sure, it seems coincidental these kind of things happening together
User avatar #415 to #414 - jokeface ONLINE (03/05/2013) [-]
Nah, my IRL identity and Jokeface must remain separate. I like the anonymity.
User avatar #417 to #415 - thebritishguy (03/05/2013) [-]
well you could just say any word, it would be just as valid, if they took the pictures and videos from a model or from another profile I doubt they would be able to do it
#405 to #404 - thebritishguy has deleted their comment [-]
User avatar #370 - ragnarfag (03/01/2013) [-]
Since we waited like 10h by now, what is your ''severed arm analogy''?
User avatar #371 to #370 - jokeface ONLINE (03/02/2013) [-]
I just got back to my computer and answered on the board. But to reiterate:

Suppose a person donates their arm to science. The arm is connected to a machine that simulates a heart, pumping clean blood through the arm to keep the tissue alive. Then suppose someone damages the arm in such away that the tissue dies. A bunch of living, human tissue. So is this person guilty of murder?
User avatar #386 to #371 - thebritishguy (03/04/2013) [-]
a murder is the taking away of a human life, not human cells
User avatar #389 to #386 - jokeface ONLINE (03/04/2013) [-]
Exactly. And what is an non-cognizant embryo if not just a collection of cells? Until it's aware, it may be "living" tissue but it's not "alive"
User avatar #392 to #389 - thebritishguy (03/04/2013) [-]
yeah, your right, did you see that post which said "if abortion is murder, are blowjobs cannibalism?"
User avatar #395 to #392 - jokeface ONLINE (03/05/2013) [-]
Exactly. It's absurd.
User avatar #364 - whtkid ONLINE (03/01/2013) [-]
Good luck on the sex!!
User avatar #365 to #364 - jokeface ONLINE (03/01/2013) [-]
Actually I'm waiting until marriage, but thank you for the sentiment. :)
User avatar #363 - OpticalIllusion (03/01/2013) [-]
Best of luck with your net girlfriend, hope you get some righteous sex.
User avatar #366 to #363 - jokeface ONLINE (03/01/2013) [-]
As I said to Whtkid, we're waiting until marriage. But thank you. :)
User avatar #372 to #366 - OpticalIllusion (03/02/2013) [-]
Whatever floats your boat.

I hope all is going well?
User avatar #376 to #372 - jokeface ONLINE (03/02/2013) [-]
So far so good. She gets on her flight in about 12 hours.
#356 - thebritishguy (02/28/2013) [-]
if you don't get it it is a version of big brother from the book "1984"
User avatar #357 to #356 - jokeface ONLINE (02/28/2013) [-]
I get the reference. Still doesn't deter my faith in the slightest.
User avatar #361 to #357 - thebritishguy (02/28/2013) [-]
just saying
User avatar #367 to #361 - jokeface ONLINE (03/01/2013) [-]
Noted.
User avatar #318 - thebritishguy (02/26/2013) [-]
Jesus and God are hilariously similar to an abusive boyfriends
You need to login to view this link
User avatar #319 to #318 - jokeface ONLINE (02/27/2013) [-]
Okay, let's see...He doesn't verbally abuse us...doesn't control our money...doesn't isolate us...He's never been cruel to anyone...so we can rule out "Controlling" as a characteristic. I'd say He's more influential, seeing as His teachings and requisites can certainly impact people, though He doesn't force them on anyone.

He does have special rights but He sure as hell earned them by saving us. Nothing He demands are unreasonable and in fact we're getting much more than we deserve out of the deal. He's never violent either. So "Entitlement" isn't really applicable except for the fact that He has indeed earned what He asks of us.

"Selfishness and Self-centeredness" sure doesn't fit, since His sacrifice was entirely selfless, and His choice of inviting us into His kingdom is hugely charitable and not self-centered at all.

He holds no contempt for anyone. Contempt for sin, yes, but not for people. We're all loved infinitely by Christ. So "Superiority" doesn't apply.

He never claimed we were His possessions. He gives us full freedom from Himself. When He asked a rich man to give up all his wealth to follow Him and the rich man chose to turn Him down, Jesus never pressured Him. He just let Him go. Following Him is our choice, not His. So no "Possessiveness".

Again, He's never been violent. Unless you count flipping the tables at the temple, but He wasn't hurting people there, just making a mess. So He doesn't "Confuse Love and Abuse."

"Manipulativeness"...Nope. Not by this definition. Nothing He says is confusing or distorting, and He never lies.

He's not "Contradictory" either. He always practiced what He preached, and all of His teachings are clear and straightforward.

I don't understand how He could be "Externalizing Responsibility" either. This thing talks about shifting blame, but Jesus was blameless. Pure of all sin.

And "Denial" doesn't apply because as I've been making quite clear throughout this list, Jesus has no guilt to deny. He was, and still is, perfect.
User avatar #321 to #319 - thebritishguy (02/27/2013) [-]
Jesus lied a lot, you really need to look at this website more mate
www.evilbible.com/Jesus_Lied.htm
User avatar #326 to #321 - jokeface ONLINE (02/27/2013) [-]
1. The key word being faith. Humans are capable of immense amount of faith, but no one can truly trust God infinitely as Jesus did. Therefore, no one can harness His power (except the Disciples to some degree).

2. He's referring to His grace. If you seek the grace of Christ, He will save you. But if not, then you will never receive it. Plain and simple.

3. I don't understand how that one is a lie.

4. This one could be answered with my response to #1.

5. Same as #2.

6. I had to read the chapter this came from for context. It appears He's referring to the Disciples. Like I said, they were able to pull off some crazy Jesus **** themselves.

7. God makes all things possible through the works of nature and people. Whatever you want, if you believe in Christ, He will make it reachable in one way or another.

8. See #7.

9. See #1 yet again. Or #7. They both fit.
User avatar #320 to #319 - thebritishguy (02/27/2013) [-]
what about God?
User avatar #323 to #320 - jokeface ONLINE (02/27/2013) [-]
Jesus and God are the same entity. I mean in the Bible God created a physical form for Jesus while He was on Earth, but in general they're both one being. That's the thing about the Trinity. God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit are all just different faces of the same single God.
User avatar #324 to #323 - thebritishguy (02/27/2013) [-]
ohohohohohohhhoooo noooooooooooooo God was insane he doesn't fit this description
also here are some contradictions: www.evilbible.com/Biblical%20Contradictions.htm
User avatar #327 to #324 - jokeface ONLINE (02/27/2013) [-]
No, man, I'm bored with this. Look, I'm happy you like to do research (even if it all comes from the same site), but I'm not gonna keep reading lists and replying to bullet points and **** , half of which are addressing the same specific issue. If you wanna have an actual discussion, then discuss. But I'm not wasting my time responding to URLs.
User avatar #332 to #331 - jokeface ONLINE (02/28/2013) [-]
This pic is old and I'm pretty sure most atheists are smart enough to know it's being satirical of them. You just made fun of yourself.
User avatar #335 to #332 - thebritishguy (02/28/2013) [-]
lol the pic is old? how about the ******* book, a satirical term are you high right now?
User avatar #337 to #335 - jokeface ONLINE (02/28/2013) [-]
I'm saying that it's already been established that using that picture as a rebuttal is pointless because both Christians and atheists know that those two verses are not using the same meaning of "the face of God". The fact that you think you're gaining any credibility by using that picture just shows how ignorant you are. Even among atheists.
#330 to #327 - thebritishguy (02/27/2013) [-]
well here is a list you don't have to respond with your bullet points
User avatar #297 - thebritishguy (02/25/2013) [-]
what do you think about Muslims?
User avatar #300 to #297 - jokeface ONLINE (02/25/2013) [-]
They're lost brothers who I wish could be returned to the light.
User avatar #301 to #300 - thebritishguy (02/25/2013) [-]
they would say the same about you, the majority of them were never Christian so I don't know what your talking about, you have no more evidence than them that you are right. I meant what do you think about the culture.
User avatar #306 to #301 - jokeface ONLINE (02/25/2013) [-]
I'm not really educated in their culture. All I really know is that they're very misogynistic, of which I'm not a fan.
User avatar #307 to #306 - thebritishguy (02/25/2013) [-]
they're very sexist and they have sharia law which means that 6 year olds can get married and if you steal you get your hands chopped off and just this week 50 people died in a riot because a film was made saying they were not violent, but many great men have been Muslim and obviously they're not all bad, I always try not to to judge a majority on a minority but this is what I know.
User avatar #308 to #307 - jokeface ONLINE (02/25/2013) [-]
I'll say this: On Earth, men can be good among men. God has a standard that we cannot live up to, but between us, some show greater dignity and conduct than others. And this is regardless of religion or spirituality or any of that. Gandhi was a good man among men. Malcolm X was a good man among men. I have respect for non-Christians who live good lives like them. But just understand that as good of men as they are, their goodness only benefits them in this life. For you this is fine because you don't believe in an afterlife, but for me it's distressing. I wish they were still that good and influential but just advocated Christianity.
User avatar #341 to #308 - thebritishguy (02/28/2013) [-]
Gandhi was a racist but Malcolm X was cool, according to the bible both men deserved to be burning alive for eternity.
User avatar #345 to #341 - jokeface ONLINE (02/28/2013) [-]
The keyword being "deserved". Please understand that the difference between going to heaven and going to hell is not based on what someone "deserves". I believe in Jesus Christ, but I still don't deserve to go to heaven. I'm just as wicked as the next person, and I should be burning for eternity too. But the way we go to heaven is not by "deserving" to go there. If that was the case then no one would ever get there. Yes, Gandhi and Malcolm X both deserve to go to hell but their faith in Christ would not change that. They're still just as sinful as anyone else, no matter what. The only difference between going to heaven or hell is whether you accept Christ's gift. And doing so does not make you a better person, it just grants you undeserved grace in spite of being wicked.
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