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iluvas

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Date Signed Up:12/08/2011
Last Login:4/21/2013
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Level 124 Content: Respected Member Of Famiry → Level 125 Content: Respected Member Of Famiry
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Times Content Favorited:84 times
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latest user's comments

#564 - yes and no, he never plagued cities, if you're talking bout mo…  [+] (11 replies) 04/28/2012 on switching sides +1
User avatar
#573 - mortality (04/28/2012) [-]
Egypt was one instance. There was also when he stone rained Sodom because they were living sinful lives, after he promised to spare the city if there was one righteous person within, which there supposedly was, though I wouldn't call Lot a good person. And then he killed Lot's wife in front of her family simply because she looked back at the only home she had ever known while it was burning to the ground. To defy a tyrant who does these kinds of things is not lack of logical reasoning; it is conviction to your beliefs. Except in the case of someone who just truly does not understand. I've come to believe what I do through years of study though. And I deeply respect anyone who is devoted to their religion if they really understand it, no matter what that religion may be.
#576 - iluvas (04/28/2012) [-]
likewise i respect yours too. I was not aware about the story of sodom and gomorrah but just by reading its summary on the wiki page, it definitely seem justice is served in my opinion.

Its inhabitants were raping, robbing, having homo-orgies and what not lol. And they're not doing it amongst themselves but actions affect strangers and random travellers. Heck there might even be some ritualistic practices there that will greatly affect the innocent, and i think thats why such an event occured.

And about Lot's wife, I do agree that is out of hand, but like i said I don't know the full context of the situation and can't really give my opinion on that, but I do know god is just and very rarely does he intervene in matters regarding dunya.

So I'm going on a whim here and assume, in your opinion, if god truely is 'good' in your point of view, he would simply leave the city to devastate even more innocent ppl? lol
User avatar
#581 - mortality (04/28/2012) [-]
I'm not saying the city wasn't corrupt. My point is more that he claims murder as the highest of sins and then kills countless people, which is hypocrisy, a form of deceit, and a deceiver cannot be omnibenevolent. And then there's the fact that he made an oath to not destroy the city and then broke it. If he's omniscient, he knew he was going to break his oath from the beginning and deceived people into believing he planned on sparing the city. If he is not omniscient, then he has lied about his very nature again.
#590 - iluvas (04/29/2012) [-]
kills people of the city to stop a cancer.. i see nothing wrong with it... and that oath wasn't broken, its simply truly there was no 10 people who are still sane with the least faith in that city. And the only reason he made that promise wasn't because he came up with it but Lot asked for god to give the city a chance, God already knew the cities were a gone case to begin with.. but god being god merciful and forgiving gave in to Lot's request... anyways, theres many ways to look at a situation, but really I can't see how God is unjust even in your perspective, he didnt murder cuz he loves blood lol he saved others =\

I get what you're saying though, looking at the situation for what it is without considering the purpose of those actions obviously makes god look bad.
User avatar
#591 - mortality (04/29/2012) [-]
He wasn't supposed to find ten just people, only one. When he made the deal, it started with just destroying the city, and then if he could find so and so good people he would spare, and eventually they bargained until God agreed to spare it if there was just one good man, which there was, yet he still didn't spare the city. The issue I have with him isn't so much that he destroyed the city, it's that he murdered everyone there all the while saying murder was sinful. Then we get into what I saying about him being a hypocratic liar. And Sodom was merely one case. Every day, he damns great people to eternal suffering simply because they didn't worship him even if they were the greatest person in the world, but he still says he loves them as they burn and then evil men can get eternal bliss simply by saying God is Lord. What does that tell you about his true desire? To me, it spells narcisism and will to control, not love, especially since in the Bible it also says that humanity was created to serve God and worship him. Love by God is defined in the Bible as patient, eternal, to never harm, to always protect, etcetera, but he has very clearly harmed countless people, and God himself stated clearly that if you turn from him, he will lift his hand and not protect you, and so he is lying about love because he breaks it's meaning. And then there's Job who God had no reason to lift his hand from, absolutely no reason, but Satan asked God to, so he did. So really there is no end of injustice to me
#592 - iluvas (04/29/2012) [-]
not sure about the one; wiki says ten, and i just checked the Quran and i can't even find that bargaining part at all. (correct me if im wrong) o___o

and like i said those that were killed got it coming for them, they attack other innocent people... this 'murder' is as just as self defense except for other innocent people. Seriously sparring the citezens will only cause more harm... kinda hate to say it but they deserve to die, rather than other innocent people should suffer.

I do understand what you mean when you talk of God damns good people that are without faith or misled faith... however I do believe if truly their intentions are good, they always end up finding the right path. God won't leave a bro hanging lol.

And about unconditional love from God, you won't be given that, once you chose to rely on something else instead of him even after knowing him, in otherwords worship some other being or object other than the creator of everything.

And again, just cause you say i love you god, but do things God forbids you too, theres still a probability you'll go to hell, even greater so when you do worse things. All of this decision is up to god. Theres a whole study about these matters in Islam who you should act and what you should not do (not sure bout christianity) its called Akhlak

I believe there was this account of an israli prostitute in which she actually saved a dog that was dieing of thirst, and that act of kindness actually sparred her from hell... lol.. again all of it up to god to judge you, she never even embraced religion if im not mistaken.

To be honest all these fallacies you might come to know is mainly perhaps you cross reference alot of things about God through the bible? And i must say that you shouldn't cause its heavvvvvily rewritten by man, to fulfill his agenda.
User avatar
#594 - mortality (04/29/2012) [-]
It's in there, in Genesis. Again, I'm not saying the people of Sodom weren't bad people, it's just the fact of the matter is that God went back on his word, which makes him imperfect. And since he's imperfect, he cannot be omniscient, omnipotent, or omnibenevolent, which means he lied to make himself out to be that way. Why would he need to lie unless he was trying to deceive humanity to serve his own purposes? I do reference the Bible for facts, such as the destruction of Sodom, but I do not at all believe what it says about God's nature.
#596 - iluvas (04/29/2012) [-]
hmm ok so I'll just assume it is 1 person needed to save sodom and gomorrah and that one person is lot... but god still destroyed the city... when these parameters in mind; taken from the bible as you said... yes what you say totally makes sense, and i agree with you.

but because I'm very suspicious of the bible, I still tend to see the story set up this way to be wrong... lol, but its awesome how you manage to put the pieces of the puzzle from the bible together to see the bigger picture.
User avatar
#597 - mortality (04/30/2012) [-]
The thing about the puzzle, is that it's like all the pieces are square, so they fit anywhere to make endless combinations of images, some making sense others not so much. Lot's of people have put the puzzle together in different ways to make different pictures. This is the picture I've put together.
#593 - iluvas (04/29/2012) [-]
you can still use the bible though, that is if you can read the original koine greek version, i think thats the most reliable source of the injil you can get. Directly from jesus's mouth rather than iterations made by man.
User avatar
#595 - mortality (04/29/2012) [-]
I've actually read the Bible in Hebrew, with some help from my brother-in-law
#54 - K fine..... it has to come to this... your first comm…  [+] (4 replies) 04/27/2012 on Go to Heck +1
#55 - anon (04/27/2012) [-]
You believe a fucking book. A heretical book at that. Don't tell me to cite sources when you're ONLY source is that of a dying old decrepit man, written by people after his death. Hogwash. I'm done with this conversation, your wealth of knowledge on this subject is as shallow as a dried up lake.
#57 - iluvas (04/27/2012) [-]
and your abilities to debate is a total reflection of what you said of a brainwashed subject, except in your case that master being the devil.

I really hope you're not acting like this because you are simply against religion for the sake of it... like a trend... It seems like it though, none of my logic or reasoning has even been considered by you...
#56 - anon (04/27/2012) [-]
BTW, I'm the same anon from #33. So I guess as long as I'm not attacking YOUR religion, it's agreeable, right? Fucking hypocrite.
#58 - iluvas (04/27/2012) [-]
to be honest, i've tried defending words from the injil, quran and torah cause they are all the same message... but I'm just one guy, and people like you make it impossible, so i just stick to defending my direct beliefs. and im simply taking the approach fj community does in instilling satanic principles in funnyjunkers like this post, do it through satirical jokes, and thats what i did in reply to your #33
#33 - that is assuming god is anything of a human being, with ego, l…  [+] (13 replies) 04/27/2012 on switching sides +1
User avatar
#71 - mortality (04/27/2012) [-]
Yes, he is depicted as not being that way, yet he is. He burned and plagued cities at a time simply because they wouldn't follow him. Then, while he claims to love everyone, he leaves those who do not submit and worship him to burn for all eternity.
#564 - iluvas (04/28/2012) [-]
yes and no, he never plagued cities, if you're talking bout moses the only reason they were plagued is because they oppressed him, if those guys actually let moses do his own shit i doubt any crap will happen to them.

and about that, if the positive were to embrace the negative wouldn't that simply make positive and negative both the same thing? What you insinuate is actually one of the higher ups agendas whether you know it or not.

But again in fairness it is said everyone will eventually come to be told of the truth in one form or another, there is never someone who doesn't know about the truth, but if they still wish to turn their backs on it because of ego, selfishness, lack of logical reasoning, other illnesses of the heart... hey you asked for it =\
User avatar
#573 - mortality (04/28/2012) [-]
Egypt was one instance. There was also when he stone rained Sodom because they were living sinful lives, after he promised to spare the city if there was one righteous person within, which there supposedly was, though I wouldn't call Lot a good person. And then he killed Lot's wife in front of her family simply because she looked back at the only home she had ever known while it was burning to the ground. To defy a tyrant who does these kinds of things is not lack of logical reasoning; it is conviction to your beliefs. Except in the case of someone who just truly does not understand. I've come to believe what I do through years of study though. And I deeply respect anyone who is devoted to their religion if they really understand it, no matter what that religion may be.
#576 - iluvas (04/28/2012) [-]
likewise i respect yours too. I was not aware about the story of sodom and gomorrah but just by reading its summary on the wiki page, it definitely seem justice is served in my opinion.

Its inhabitants were raping, robbing, having homo-orgies and what not lol. And they're not doing it amongst themselves but actions affect strangers and random travellers. Heck there might even be some ritualistic practices there that will greatly affect the innocent, and i think thats why such an event occured.

And about Lot's wife, I do agree that is out of hand, but like i said I don't know the full context of the situation and can't really give my opinion on that, but I do know god is just and very rarely does he intervene in matters regarding dunya.

So I'm going on a whim here and assume, in your opinion, if god truely is 'good' in your point of view, he would simply leave the city to devastate even more innocent ppl? lol
User avatar
#581 - mortality (04/28/2012) [-]
I'm not saying the city wasn't corrupt. My point is more that he claims murder as the highest of sins and then kills countless people, which is hypocrisy, a form of deceit, and a deceiver cannot be omnibenevolent. And then there's the fact that he made an oath to not destroy the city and then broke it. If he's omniscient, he knew he was going to break his oath from the beginning and deceived people into believing he planned on sparing the city. If he is not omniscient, then he has lied about his very nature again.
#590 - iluvas (04/29/2012) [-]
kills people of the city to stop a cancer.. i see nothing wrong with it... and that oath wasn't broken, its simply truly there was no 10 people who are still sane with the least faith in that city. And the only reason he made that promise wasn't because he came up with it but Lot asked for god to give the city a chance, God already knew the cities were a gone case to begin with.. but god being god merciful and forgiving gave in to Lot's request... anyways, theres many ways to look at a situation, but really I can't see how God is unjust even in your perspective, he didnt murder cuz he loves blood lol he saved others =\

I get what you're saying though, looking at the situation for what it is without considering the purpose of those actions obviously makes god look bad.
User avatar
#591 - mortality (04/29/2012) [-]
He wasn't supposed to find ten just people, only one. When he made the deal, it started with just destroying the city, and then if he could find so and so good people he would spare, and eventually they bargained until God agreed to spare it if there was just one good man, which there was, yet he still didn't spare the city. The issue I have with him isn't so much that he destroyed the city, it's that he murdered everyone there all the while saying murder was sinful. Then we get into what I saying about him being a hypocratic liar. And Sodom was merely one case. Every day, he damns great people to eternal suffering simply because they didn't worship him even if they were the greatest person in the world, but he still says he loves them as they burn and then evil men can get eternal bliss simply by saying God is Lord. What does that tell you about his true desire? To me, it spells narcisism and will to control, not love, especially since in the Bible it also says that humanity was created to serve God and worship him. Love by God is defined in the Bible as patient, eternal, to never harm, to always protect, etcetera, but he has very clearly harmed countless people, and God himself stated clearly that if you turn from him, he will lift his hand and not protect you, and so he is lying about love because he breaks it's meaning. And then there's Job who God had no reason to lift his hand from, absolutely no reason, but Satan asked God to, so he did. So really there is no end of injustice to me
#592 - iluvas (04/29/2012) [-]
not sure about the one; wiki says ten, and i just checked the Quran and i can't even find that bargaining part at all. (correct me if im wrong) o___o

and like i said those that were killed got it coming for them, they attack other innocent people... this 'murder' is as just as self defense except for other innocent people. Seriously sparring the citezens will only cause more harm... kinda hate to say it but they deserve to die, rather than other innocent people should suffer.

I do understand what you mean when you talk of God damns good people that are without faith or misled faith... however I do believe if truly their intentions are good, they always end up finding the right path. God won't leave a bro hanging lol.

And about unconditional love from God, you won't be given that, once you chose to rely on something else instead of him even after knowing him, in otherwords worship some other being or object other than the creator of everything.

And again, just cause you say i love you god, but do things God forbids you too, theres still a probability you'll go to hell, even greater so when you do worse things. All of this decision is up to god. Theres a whole study about these matters in Islam who you should act and what you should not do (not sure bout christianity) its called Akhlak

I believe there was this account of an israli prostitute in which she actually saved a dog that was dieing of thirst, and that act of kindness actually sparred her from hell... lol.. again all of it up to god to judge you, she never even embraced religion if im not mistaken.

To be honest all these fallacies you might come to know is mainly perhaps you cross reference alot of things about God through the bible? And i must say that you shouldn't cause its heavvvvvily rewritten by man, to fulfill his agenda.
User avatar
#594 - mortality (04/29/2012) [-]
It's in there, in Genesis. Again, I'm not saying the people of Sodom weren't bad people, it's just the fact of the matter is that God went back on his word, which makes him imperfect. And since he's imperfect, he cannot be omniscient, omnipotent, or omnibenevolent, which means he lied to make himself out to be that way. Why would he need to lie unless he was trying to deceive humanity to serve his own purposes? I do reference the Bible for facts, such as the destruction of Sodom, but I do not at all believe what it says about God's nature.
#596 - iluvas (04/29/2012) [-]
hmm ok so I'll just assume it is 1 person needed to save sodom and gomorrah and that one person is lot... but god still destroyed the city... when these parameters in mind; taken from the bible as you said... yes what you say totally makes sense, and i agree with you.

but because I'm very suspicious of the bible, I still tend to see the story set up this way to be wrong... lol, but its awesome how you manage to put the pieces of the puzzle from the bible together to see the bigger picture.
User avatar
#597 - mortality (04/30/2012) [-]
The thing about the puzzle, is that it's like all the pieces are square, so they fit anywhere to make endless combinations of images, some making sense others not so much. Lot's of people have put the puzzle together in different ways to make different pictures. This is the picture I've put together.
#593 - iluvas (04/29/2012) [-]
you can still use the bible though, that is if you can read the original koine greek version, i think thats the most reliable source of the injil you can get. Directly from jesus's mouth rather than iterations made by man.
User avatar
#595 - mortality (04/29/2012) [-]
I've actually read the Bible in Hebrew, with some help from my brother-in-law
#30 - But that didn't prove what Jesus said was wrong now did it =\,…  [+] (10 replies) 04/27/2012 on switching sides +2
User avatar
#32 - dingojohn (04/27/2012) [-]
Don't get me wrong, Jesus was a cool bro, what he preached was cool and even his fukken beard was cool !

It's just that everybody who follows him seems to be ignoring what he said... All catholics especially.
#41 - totallywhiteguy (04/27/2012) [-]
that is pretty untrue. I am catholic, and all of my friends are atheist, I really don't care. The two things I live by are: "Let he who is without sin throw the first stone" and "I give unto you a new commandment: that you love one another". (sorry I don't have the exact book, chapter, and verse)
#77 - GRice (04/27/2012) [-]
They're both in Matthew, though I couldn't give you the exact chapter/verse. The first is during the story of the adultress. The second is in one of Jesus' sermons during Matthew, I believe when the Pharisees ask him what the most important rule is. He tells 'em, "...to love the Lord with all your heart, mind, and soul. And the second is like it, that you love your neighbor as yourself."

Btw, if anyone hasn't seen a play called Godspel(l?) it's a pretty good watch.
User avatar
#49 - dingojohn (04/27/2012) [-]
I don't remember any of the exact verses or chapters either, but consider this:

Jesus goes rampage in the synagoge (right?) because it's a market, and no man should make a profit of religion: Catholic church is most powerful and rich organization for 1000 years. And the church takes money for granting you paradise, without the purgatory. I am sure Jesus think it's a good idea to let you pay with money for your crimes?

And through one of his stories, he tells of how it's a bad thing to show off your religion in public, to show off that you are a very religious man. Prayers and such should be done in your home, or in private along with other believers: Pope drives around a great, armoured car (why armoured, if he's destined by God to be killed at a certain day, then the armour is for nothing?) with a great white hat, and everybody is farting around yelling "Y U NO BEILIEVE IN JESUS, LOOK AT HOW GOOD A CHRISTIAN I AM !"

I could go on. Understand me right, other people's religion is none of my business, but I will never understand it. Also, i'm tired of the church screwing everything up for good people. Telling people in Africa not to wear condoms > AIDS spread > millions die > "AIDS is God's punishment for your sins!"
User avatar
#70 - houseofbrick (04/27/2012) [-]
While I agree with you on the greater Catholic church being fairly corrupt and immoral, individual Catholics are nice people and the Catholic church, starting with Vatican II in the 60's, has become one of the more liberal churches. Just because there are a bunch of hardcore conservatives who switched over to saying they were Catholic to avoid the negative publicity of Southern Baptist televangelist types doesn't mean that all Catholics are bad or agree entirely with the church. Think of it a little bit like a country: just because a country holds certain policies doesn't mean that all of its citizens hold those ideals close to their hearts.
#57 - totallywhiteguy (04/27/2012) [-]
The church doesn't take money for its own profit... It has a collect but the money is used for charitable purposes
User avatar
#61 - dingojohn (04/27/2012) [-]
Such as building huge cathedrals, preventing people from eradicating deadly STD's and influencing entire countries to give them even more money.
#40 - iluvas (04/27/2012) [-]
my thoughts exactly
#38 - ftsfts (04/27/2012) [-]
Hey man don't say all Catholics, I'm Catholic and I honestly don't care if another person is atheist, gay, or anything.
#31 - iluvas (04/27/2012) [-]
oh i take it back didn't read your first line, live by the sword die by the sword thing.... made wrong comment, take it like a man...