Upload
Login or register

hydraetis

Last status update:
-
Gender: male
Date Signed Up:12/07/2010
Last Login:10/27/2015
Stats
Content Thumbs: 2661 total,  2924 ,  263
Comment Thumbs: 12974 total,  16215 ,  3241
Content Level Progress: 44% (44/100)
Level 120 Content: Respected Member Of Famiry → Level 121 Content: Respected Member Of Famiry
Comment Level Progress: 89% (89/100)
Level 305 Comments: Lord Of Laughs → Level 306 Comments: Lord Of Laughs
Subscribers:0
Content Views:145952
Times Content Favorited:171 times
Total Comments Made:7428
FJ Points:12739

latest user's comments

#23 - Okay except just because an animal can eat something doesn't m…  [+] (3 replies) 09/20/2015 on Truth +7
#25 - anon (09/20/2015) [-]
Fruits, not really. If anything humans have a larger variety of food than animals.
User avatar
#43 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
So? That doesn't really prove anything.

Ex: Humans can eat a wider variety of shit than vultures, but vultures can still eat carrion without any issues whereas if a human tried to eat carrion, they'd probably get fucking wrecked by parasites and diseases.

Ex 2: Phytolacca americana (pokeweed). Birds, deer, and other animals can eat the berries no problem, but a person can end up dead from eating them. there are quite a few things that birds can eat no problem but that humans can only eat with lots of problems
User avatar
#24 - dreygur (09/20/2015) [-]
If that dog is eating something from on the street, nobody's gonna stop me
#67 - Considering I've seen many times where the person has their ar…  [+] (20 replies) 09/20/2015 on Don't worry I'm a doctor +1
#111 - drewjitsu (09/20/2015) [-]
Choke is a basic move, means usually one of the first learned. Means it is also first defense learned, loads of practice. Chokes can be hard because of that. Muay Thai doesn't teach to eat kicks. Leg kicks are checked, upper body kicks blocked or dodged. Seems like you're spouting out a bunch of theoretical stuff. Head kick takedown defense. Happens, but not often because of high risk (if you miss you're fucked). You talk about knockouts being a result of a missed punch/countered punch as if it is is a bad thing. Step one of landing a counter punch is the counter, parry or dodge. Both of those things will result in the other guy missing a punch. Your statement is like commenting that every time you've seen the sky with a pink/purple hue, the sun was rising or setting. You dont seem to factor in fatigue either.

Anyway, you come off as basement dwelling neckbeard who knows a thing or two about traditional martial arts and the theory of how they could be applied. You seem arrogant because you're lobbing criticism as the folks at the top of the food chain. Those people aren't in the spotlight because their fans voted them there. Those folks are in the spotlight because they won a shit ton of fights using what you've apparently found to be inadequate technique. I'm interested to know why they're the best in the world and you aren't. Get off of FJ and go win some titles! Make money!
User avatar
#144 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Okay, except you're ignoring the fact that everybody goes by the same technique. If one guy using inadequate technique beats a whole bunch of other people using inadequate technique, he's still using inadequate technique. And you seem to be completely missing the point I was talking about with the K.O. punches. My point there was that they quite often throw punches while leaving one side completely open by not having their non-punching hand in a position to defend themselves with it.

And by the way, that shit that they're doing in the GIFs absolutely amounts to eating the full force of the kick. Okay, they're using a harder spot to do it, but they're still taking 100% of the kick nonetheless. And then as for why hitting with the shin or flat of the foot isn't the most effective way to do it, answer this: When you swing a hammer, is it more effective to hit with the head of the hammer or the shaft?
#146 - drewjitsu (09/20/2015) [-]
There are pros and cons to every style, dude. There is no trump card. They don't all use the same technique. Most of them use similar techniques, but if there really were a one-style-beats-all, someone would have adopted it and started winning already. Hasn't really happened. The hammer thing: What's on the end of a hammer? solid hunk of metal. What's on the end of a leg? Foot with lots of small bones. Good risk of hurting your foot, that's why I don't like those kicks. However, they work well for some folks, just not me.

Also, that shit they're doing in the GIFs is breaking their opponents' leg in half so I think it works pretty fuckin' well. As someone who has done a little muay thai, however, checking a kick and eating one feel nothing alike. Checking also provides you a chance to throw your opponent off balance.

Defending whilst throwing: Keep off hand all blocky-blocky and roll the shoulder of punch hand. Shoulder protects jaw. That's what I see most of them doing before they gas. When fighters get tired, that can go out the window pretty quickly.

Lastly, though: If their technique is inadequate, why hasn't someone come in with your technique and risen to the top with little to no resistance?
#149 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Except what I'm talking about isn't the kicking with the top of the foot. I fully acknowledge that doing so is retarded and it is super easy to fuck someone up that does try and do that. But think about how you kick a soccer ball if you want it to really go far without giving a fuck about accuracy. What do you do? You kick it like you're swinging a hammer, as in with a straight foot connecting with your toes instead of the flat. Now kick a person like that instead of with your shin, and you're going from hitting the guy with a pole to striking them more precisely with a hammer. Of course you'll probably bring up the fact of mashing your toes, and to that I say that's why you pull your toes up albeit definitely need to be bent further than the person in the picture to connect with this part of the foot instead. Congratulations, you now have a for more penetrating roundhouse kick to really punch into those sensitive nerves and disable the guy immediately.
User avatar
#160 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
Kicking with the ball of your foot is a legitimate technique, we see it employed all the time in MMA. Its not as crippling as you're making it out to be, unless it lands in a vital spot in which case a kick with the shin will likely be as effective. Its also a much more difficult technique to successfully execute... using your example is it easier to hit a moving target with the head of a hammer or a baseball bat?
User avatar
#148 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Great points, especially the last one. Apparently everyone in the world is just learning the wrong technique except for this kid.
User avatar
#68 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
You've already demonstrated you know nothing about wrestling with your comment about head kicking your way out of takedowns. So I'd wager to say that in the fights you're watching you don't understand what is going on in the grappling exchanges.

What is a more effective striking style in a real fight than muay thai then? The magical striking style that only you and your father know from his (im just guessing here) undocumented fights in Kumite in Asia years ago? Is your father Frank Dux?
#134 - ainise (09/20/2015) [-]
Do any really effective fighting styles limit to one? Krav Maga, one of the more popular special ops fighting style for armies around the world (especially in the middle east) is a mixture of boxing techniques and grapples. You'll likely never see it in any ring, though, because it's intended to kill not pacify. Most of its moves are illegal in the ring, but you're talking real fights.

LINE is the Marine's special forces fighting style of choice. Again, it's intended to kill not pacify. It's a very brutal style overall and again, you'll never see it in an MMA ring.

Lerdrit is what the elite commandos of the Thai Royal Army use, which is basically Muay Thai + Muay Boran re-built with the intention to kill and with no rules. It's basically 1) Attack without warning, 2) Kill.

There are dozens of hidden weapon styles intended to quickly assassinate and kill a person. Some types of Ninjitsu, Many African arts, Most older Chinese non-competitive fighting styles, Silat, Okichitaw, etc.

For the ring, I'm pretty sure you're right. It's certainly one of the top 5 most popular fighting styles to learn in MMA, but for real fighting? There are no rules. The other guy can pull a knife, sword, gun, etc out on you. Even in its own country they didn't consider it good enough to stand on its own for unarmed fighting.
User avatar
#136 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
I'm more referring to the fact that he says muay thai isn't effective when it certainly is as far as a pure standup style goes.
User avatar
#109 - stickmanz (09/20/2015) [-]
I want to comment on how your observations seem lacking, but im a standing fighter who knows shit all so far about gappeling past the very basics so you know what, i'd like to hear why a head kick to a waist grab takedown doesn't work

i thumbed you back up so please don't flame me, im just trying to become a better fighter
#147 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Here is an example of a knee KO to an opponent shooting in for a takedown, Joachim Hansen vs Imanari. Great finish, one of the coolest ever, but still stuff like this is an exception and incredibly rare. (read my last three comments in reverse order so that they make some sense)
User avatar
#153 - stickmanz (09/21/2015) [-]
why was the other fighter that low, i can't tell what he's doing with that quality
User avatar
#156 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
Also, here is a link to the full fight in the above gif, Much better quality and you can see whats happening a lot better. Skip to around 3:30 for the KO if you don't wanna watch the whole thing.

www.dailymotion.com/video/xzrcm1_joachim-hansen-vs-masakazu-imanari_sport
#155 - nywrestler has deleted their comment.
#154 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
Shooting for a double leg takedown. Proper technique is to change levels and shoot in on the opponents legs in one swift motion and drive through them or L-cut and dump them to the side. Usually a wrestler will try to time their takedown like in this gif to the left here.
User avatar
#157 - stickmanz (09/21/2015) [-]
oh i understand then
User avatar
#158 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
To clarify from earlier, I'm not saying anything bad about any standup martial art or any type of martial art in general. I just don't like it when people start making stuff up as they go along like the guy was doing earlier. I don't like when people with no legitimate basis of knowledge or training think that they know how to fight or understand fighting better than people who do it professionally. He was literally saying that he knows how to grapple/choke better than people who have gold medals in national and world level grappling competitions.
User avatar
#159 - stickmanz (09/21/2015) [-]
Yo i feel you, thats why i try to never talk bigger than i can back up,
User avatar
#141 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Just to further expand on my last comment, a knee to an opponent shooting for a takedown is usually going to be much more effective than a kick because of how close the opponent will be after initiating the takedown. Still though, the timing and accuracy required is so exact that it is still going to be a low percentage move which will likely end up with missing or being a glancing blow and ending in a takedown.
User avatar
#135 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Just for the reason I said before, It can be effective and I've seen it happen many times, but a lot more likely is that you aren't going to get the KO and will just be off balance and easier to take down.
#58 - Actually, yea, I do. From my dad who did 50 competitive fights…  [+] (26 replies) 09/20/2015 on Don't worry I'm a doctor +4
#69 - ainise (09/20/2015) [-]
I mean..look at the rules. All of the proper responses to that low kick are fucking illegal.

If I were fit and capable to reason inside the ring, my response to that low kick would be to either step in and use my knee on the inside of his thigh/knee & follow up with a punch or to simply return a kick with my right leg to his kidney...

Both of which are illegal. And that's why I always had trouble getting into fighting sports. It's just not a real fight. When you grapple someone in a real fight, the quickest way to end the fight is a hammerfist to a vital organ, but every part of that is illegal in the ring - mind you that's for good reason, but it's just not a real fight.

The fundamental of many of martial arts is to end the fight with as few injuries to yourself as possible. As such, you aim for much more dangerous attacks. Neck, nose, solar plexus, knees, kidneys, etc. You use much more dangerous attacks, like Hammerfists, Gouging, hooking, Spiking, Cranks, Headbutts, Violent Grapples, etc.

Asian Martial Arts, on the other hand, is much more underground. China and Vietnam are famous for both being dangerous places to fight in, as a lot of their rules are(or at least were when I last researched this) much more laxed and a much MUCH higher rate of injury exists there. So that can be a lot of what you're seeing.
User avatar
#138 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
A kick to the kidney or a knee to the thigh are not illegal in MMA. People get dropped and finished by kidney shots or liver shots all the time.

Do you have any sources where I can read about or watch these underground Asian martial arts fights? Sounds really interesting.
#143 - ainise (09/20/2015) [-]
Illegal Actions:
"Strikes to the neck, throat, spine, kidneys, joints, groin, knees and below"

This appears to be the amateur MMA rules - my mistake.

As for watching illegal fighting matches..well it's not easy to find and it's even harder to stomach some of those fights. I happened across a video site on mIRC back in the day...the fights were a bit...gruesome. I'm sure there gambling sites for underground fights today, but with the Chinese government's attitude on internet, I'd be surprised if they got out of the country.

If they do exist, you'd have to find em on the dark web.
User avatar
#91 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
You present a much better argument than anyone else I have come across. I can easily argue better counters because, despite what most MMA fanboys claim, there are a shitload of things you can do that are vastly more effective. But if the rules restrict anyone from being allowed to do those things, then not really anything I can say other than those rules are dumb from my perspective.

Those responses are exactly along the lines of what I'd say to do, and I'm of the same mind where I feel like it's more of a glorified and restricted bar room brawl than highly skilful fighting. And that underground shit is the type of thing that my dad did when he was travelling through Asia with the NZ navy his commanding officer let him pursue the fighting/martial arts stuff after catching wind of a scuffle between my dad and a few gang members specialising in brutally attacking people in uniform. Was him against 7 guys, he knocked out two of them and broke the leader's collarbone to make the guy scream, scaring off the rest of them. . The rules were no nutshots and no eye gouges, but even if you broke the rules the other guy only had like 5 minutes or something to recover, and if he wasn't able to continue the fight after those 5 minutes then you won anyway.
User avatar
#62 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Not going to comment on the stuff about your dad fighting history or your insane fighting skillz because I don't know you or your dad so I'll just say "ok".

To your point about the choking opportunities, these are the same guys that do national and world level grappling competitions. Some of them are literally among the greatest grapplers on the planet, as evidenced by national/world level grappling competitions like Abu Dhabi, IBJJF world championships, Pan Am games, etc. I can tell you they are well aware of any chokes that are available to them.

As for the swift kick to the top of the head thing, you realize that if you don't connect with that kick and knock them out that you are definitely going to get taken down. A knee to the jaw will work too, but again you are sacrificing a ton of balance to do either of the those things and basically conceding the takedown. Regardless most times you aren't going to knock someone out with a kick or a knee because its not a high success rate move. That's why in most cases people do that "dumb grapping" crap as you put it, also known as wrestling. You're much less likely to end up on your back.

Keeping your hands up is an integral part of boxing and MMA. Good technique is to keep your hands up and defend yourself. Not everyone has good technique, a lot of people do. It sounds like the special that you were watching was probably about counter punch KOs or something.

In both of those clips above the person "did something about it" by checking it. That is a defense for that kick. You bring your shin up so that instead of him kicking you in your meaty lower thing he kicks you in the strongest part of your shin bone, right below the knee. That is one of the most basic concepts in muay thai.
User avatar
#67 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Considering I've seen many times where the person has their arm behind the guy's neck, then when they pull it out instead of putting it in a position in front of the neck where you can quite fuckin easily make oxygen a problem for the other guy, they go ahead and do something else, they are absolutely unaware. That or, the strict Step 1 Step 2 drills that they all have don't include anything you can do from that angle.

And I think I've pointed out that what Muay Thai does which usually boils down to taking the full force of the hit in spot A or spot B is not exactly the most effective option.
#111 - drewjitsu (09/20/2015) [-]
Choke is a basic move, means usually one of the first learned. Means it is also first defense learned, loads of practice. Chokes can be hard because of that. Muay Thai doesn't teach to eat kicks. Leg kicks are checked, upper body kicks blocked or dodged. Seems like you're spouting out a bunch of theoretical stuff. Head kick takedown defense. Happens, but not often because of high risk (if you miss you're fucked). You talk about knockouts being a result of a missed punch/countered punch as if it is is a bad thing. Step one of landing a counter punch is the counter, parry or dodge. Both of those things will result in the other guy missing a punch. Your statement is like commenting that every time you've seen the sky with a pink/purple hue, the sun was rising or setting. You dont seem to factor in fatigue either.

Anyway, you come off as basement dwelling neckbeard who knows a thing or two about traditional martial arts and the theory of how they could be applied. You seem arrogant because you're lobbing criticism as the folks at the top of the food chain. Those people aren't in the spotlight because their fans voted them there. Those folks are in the spotlight because they won a shit ton of fights using what you've apparently found to be inadequate technique. I'm interested to know why they're the best in the world and you aren't. Get off of FJ and go win some titles! Make money!
User avatar
#144 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Okay, except you're ignoring the fact that everybody goes by the same technique. If one guy using inadequate technique beats a whole bunch of other people using inadequate technique, he's still using inadequate technique. And you seem to be completely missing the point I was talking about with the K.O. punches. My point there was that they quite often throw punches while leaving one side completely open by not having their non-punching hand in a position to defend themselves with it.

And by the way, that shit that they're doing in the GIFs absolutely amounts to eating the full force of the kick. Okay, they're using a harder spot to do it, but they're still taking 100% of the kick nonetheless. And then as for why hitting with the shin or flat of the foot isn't the most effective way to do it, answer this: When you swing a hammer, is it more effective to hit with the head of the hammer or the shaft?
#146 - drewjitsu (09/20/2015) [-]
There are pros and cons to every style, dude. There is no trump card. They don't all use the same technique. Most of them use similar techniques, but if there really were a one-style-beats-all, someone would have adopted it and started winning already. Hasn't really happened. The hammer thing: What's on the end of a hammer? solid hunk of metal. What's on the end of a leg? Foot with lots of small bones. Good risk of hurting your foot, that's why I don't like those kicks. However, they work well for some folks, just not me.

Also, that shit they're doing in the GIFs is breaking their opponents' leg in half so I think it works pretty fuckin' well. As someone who has done a little muay thai, however, checking a kick and eating one feel nothing alike. Checking also provides you a chance to throw your opponent off balance.

Defending whilst throwing: Keep off hand all blocky-blocky and roll the shoulder of punch hand. Shoulder protects jaw. That's what I see most of them doing before they gas. When fighters get tired, that can go out the window pretty quickly.

Lastly, though: If their technique is inadequate, why hasn't someone come in with your technique and risen to the top with little to no resistance?
#149 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Except what I'm talking about isn't the kicking with the top of the foot. I fully acknowledge that doing so is retarded and it is super easy to fuck someone up that does try and do that. But think about how you kick a soccer ball if you want it to really go far without giving a fuck about accuracy. What do you do? You kick it like you're swinging a hammer, as in with a straight foot connecting with your toes instead of the flat. Now kick a person like that instead of with your shin, and you're going from hitting the guy with a pole to striking them more precisely with a hammer. Of course you'll probably bring up the fact of mashing your toes, and to that I say that's why you pull your toes up albeit definitely need to be bent further than the person in the picture to connect with this part of the foot instead. Congratulations, you now have a for more penetrating roundhouse kick to really punch into those sensitive nerves and disable the guy immediately.
User avatar
#160 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
Kicking with the ball of your foot is a legitimate technique, we see it employed all the time in MMA. Its not as crippling as you're making it out to be, unless it lands in a vital spot in which case a kick with the shin will likely be as effective. Its also a much more difficult technique to successfully execute... using your example is it easier to hit a moving target with the head of a hammer or a baseball bat?
User avatar
#148 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Great points, especially the last one. Apparently everyone in the world is just learning the wrong technique except for this kid.
User avatar
#68 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
You've already demonstrated you know nothing about wrestling with your comment about head kicking your way out of takedowns. So I'd wager to say that in the fights you're watching you don't understand what is going on in the grappling exchanges.

What is a more effective striking style in a real fight than muay thai then? The magical striking style that only you and your father know from his (im just guessing here) undocumented fights in Kumite in Asia years ago? Is your father Frank Dux?
#134 - ainise (09/20/2015) [-]
Do any really effective fighting styles limit to one? Krav Maga, one of the more popular special ops fighting style for armies around the world (especially in the middle east) is a mixture of boxing techniques and grapples. You'll likely never see it in any ring, though, because it's intended to kill not pacify. Most of its moves are illegal in the ring, but you're talking real fights.

LINE is the Marine's special forces fighting style of choice. Again, it's intended to kill not pacify. It's a very brutal style overall and again, you'll never see it in an MMA ring.

Lerdrit is what the elite commandos of the Thai Royal Army use, which is basically Muay Thai + Muay Boran re-built with the intention to kill and with no rules. It's basically 1) Attack without warning, 2) Kill.

There are dozens of hidden weapon styles intended to quickly assassinate and kill a person. Some types of Ninjitsu, Many African arts, Most older Chinese non-competitive fighting styles, Silat, Okichitaw, etc.

For the ring, I'm pretty sure you're right. It's certainly one of the top 5 most popular fighting styles to learn in MMA, but for real fighting? There are no rules. The other guy can pull a knife, sword, gun, etc out on you. Even in its own country they didn't consider it good enough to stand on its own for unarmed fighting.
User avatar
#136 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
I'm more referring to the fact that he says muay thai isn't effective when it certainly is as far as a pure standup style goes.
User avatar
#109 - stickmanz (09/20/2015) [-]
I want to comment on how your observations seem lacking, but im a standing fighter who knows shit all so far about gappeling past the very basics so you know what, i'd like to hear why a head kick to a waist grab takedown doesn't work

i thumbed you back up so please don't flame me, im just trying to become a better fighter
#147 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Here is an example of a knee KO to an opponent shooting in for a takedown, Joachim Hansen vs Imanari. Great finish, one of the coolest ever, but still stuff like this is an exception and incredibly rare. (read my last three comments in reverse order so that they make some sense)
User avatar
#153 - stickmanz (09/21/2015) [-]
why was the other fighter that low, i can't tell what he's doing with that quality
User avatar
#156 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
Also, here is a link to the full fight in the above gif, Much better quality and you can see whats happening a lot better. Skip to around 3:30 for the KO if you don't wanna watch the whole thing.

www.dailymotion.com/video/xzrcm1_joachim-hansen-vs-masakazu-imanari_sport
#155 - nywrestler has deleted their comment.
#154 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
Shooting for a double leg takedown. Proper technique is to change levels and shoot in on the opponents legs in one swift motion and drive through them or L-cut and dump them to the side. Usually a wrestler will try to time their takedown like in this gif to the left here.
User avatar
#157 - stickmanz (09/21/2015) [-]
oh i understand then
User avatar
#158 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
To clarify from earlier, I'm not saying anything bad about any standup martial art or any type of martial art in general. I just don't like it when people start making stuff up as they go along like the guy was doing earlier. I don't like when people with no legitimate basis of knowledge or training think that they know how to fight or understand fighting better than people who do it professionally. He was literally saying that he knows how to grapple/choke better than people who have gold medals in national and world level grappling competitions.
User avatar
#159 - stickmanz (09/21/2015) [-]
Yo i feel you, thats why i try to never talk bigger than i can back up,
User avatar
#141 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Just to further expand on my last comment, a knee to an opponent shooting for a takedown is usually going to be much more effective than a kick because of how close the opponent will be after initiating the takedown. Still though, the timing and accuracy required is so exact that it is still going to be a low percentage move which will likely end up with missing or being a glancing blow and ending in a takedown.
User avatar
#135 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Just for the reason I said before, It can be effective and I've seen it happen many times, but a lot more likely is that you aren't going to get the KO and will just be off balance and easier to take down.
#49 - Just like the kicking with the flat of the foot. If you hit th…  [+] (28 replies) 09/20/2015 on Don't worry I'm a doctor +2
User avatar
#51 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
That seems somewhat condescending to MMA fighters. Almost like you're implying that you know of some better more effective form of fighting than people who actually fight professionally know... care to elaborate?
User avatar
#58 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Actually, yea, I do. From my dad who did 50 competitive fights over in Asia before martial arts were Westernised and became a thing of show business. He even went to Muay Thai fighters which is where UFC got that shit from , and observed how they could take a ton of those kicks in the leg and still be fighting, whereas using his own kick connecting with what we call the ball of the foot, place one into the sensitive area on the outside of the thigh and, even with all their conditioning, none of said Muay Thai fighters could take more than one kick.

And then as for the rest of the stupid procedures that UFC is locked into, my favourite part is how they miss almost every opportunity to choke the guy that presents itself. To the point where they'll even have their arm barely more than a twitch away from the spot where they'd need to put it to choke the person, but they'll go for some other convoluted counter instead.

Or how the standard counter to a guy diving towards your midsection to take you down is apparently to let them grab you then go into dumb grappling crap, rather than responding with a swift kick to the top of the head for a likely K.O. or at least to the face to rattle them.

Or in a special I watched that was showing multiple clips of people getting K.O.d by a punch to the head, EVERY. SINGLE. ONE. occurred because fighter A throws a punch and either misses or grazes, then fighter B comes in with a counter punch that goes straight into fighter A's jaw because when A threw his punch, he for some stupid reason saw fit to leave his other hand all the way down by his waist because who needs to keep themselves properly defended, right?

And then more about those kicks, it seems that according to UFC they're the ultimate move since it's pretty rare to see someone actually do something about it other than just standing there and taking it. Considering the wind-up and the usual lack of guard as seen in that GIF, guy's face is wide open during the kick and probably was for a full 2 seconds before the GIF starts , you have plenty of time to either leap in and bash the guy, or bend to soften the blow and grab the guy's leg, or just back out of range if you're already far back and then pounce immediately after.
#69 - ainise (09/20/2015) [-]
I mean..look at the rules. All of the proper responses to that low kick are fucking illegal.

If I were fit and capable to reason inside the ring, my response to that low kick would be to either step in and use my knee on the inside of his thigh/knee & follow up with a punch or to simply return a kick with my right leg to his kidney...

Both of which are illegal. And that's why I always had trouble getting into fighting sports. It's just not a real fight. When you grapple someone in a real fight, the quickest way to end the fight is a hammerfist to a vital organ, but every part of that is illegal in the ring - mind you that's for good reason, but it's just not a real fight.

The fundamental of many of martial arts is to end the fight with as few injuries to yourself as possible. As such, you aim for much more dangerous attacks. Neck, nose, solar plexus, knees, kidneys, etc. You use much more dangerous attacks, like Hammerfists, Gouging, hooking, Spiking, Cranks, Headbutts, Violent Grapples, etc.

Asian Martial Arts, on the other hand, is much more underground. China and Vietnam are famous for both being dangerous places to fight in, as a lot of their rules are(or at least were when I last researched this) much more laxed and a much MUCH higher rate of injury exists there. So that can be a lot of what you're seeing.
User avatar
#138 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
A kick to the kidney or a knee to the thigh are not illegal in MMA. People get dropped and finished by kidney shots or liver shots all the time.

Do you have any sources where I can read about or watch these underground Asian martial arts fights? Sounds really interesting.
#143 - ainise (09/20/2015) [-]
Illegal Actions:
"Strikes to the neck, throat, spine, kidneys, joints, groin, knees and below"

This appears to be the amateur MMA rules - my mistake.

As for watching illegal fighting matches..well it's not easy to find and it's even harder to stomach some of those fights. I happened across a video site on mIRC back in the day...the fights were a bit...gruesome. I'm sure there gambling sites for underground fights today, but with the Chinese government's attitude on internet, I'd be surprised if they got out of the country.

If they do exist, you'd have to find em on the dark web.
User avatar
#91 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
You present a much better argument than anyone else I have come across. I can easily argue better counters because, despite what most MMA fanboys claim, there are a shitload of things you can do that are vastly more effective. But if the rules restrict anyone from being allowed to do those things, then not really anything I can say other than those rules are dumb from my perspective.

Those responses are exactly along the lines of what I'd say to do, and I'm of the same mind where I feel like it's more of a glorified and restricted bar room brawl than highly skilful fighting. And that underground shit is the type of thing that my dad did when he was travelling through Asia with the NZ navy his commanding officer let him pursue the fighting/martial arts stuff after catching wind of a scuffle between my dad and a few gang members specialising in brutally attacking people in uniform. Was him against 7 guys, he knocked out two of them and broke the leader's collarbone to make the guy scream, scaring off the rest of them. . The rules were no nutshots and no eye gouges, but even if you broke the rules the other guy only had like 5 minutes or something to recover, and if he wasn't able to continue the fight after those 5 minutes then you won anyway.
User avatar
#62 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Not going to comment on the stuff about your dad fighting history or your insane fighting skillz because I don't know you or your dad so I'll just say "ok".

To your point about the choking opportunities, these are the same guys that do national and world level grappling competitions. Some of them are literally among the greatest grapplers on the planet, as evidenced by national/world level grappling competitions like Abu Dhabi, IBJJF world championships, Pan Am games, etc. I can tell you they are well aware of any chokes that are available to them.

As for the swift kick to the top of the head thing, you realize that if you don't connect with that kick and knock them out that you are definitely going to get taken down. A knee to the jaw will work too, but again you are sacrificing a ton of balance to do either of the those things and basically conceding the takedown. Regardless most times you aren't going to knock someone out with a kick or a knee because its not a high success rate move. That's why in most cases people do that "dumb grapping" crap as you put it, also known as wrestling. You're much less likely to end up on your back.

Keeping your hands up is an integral part of boxing and MMA. Good technique is to keep your hands up and defend yourself. Not everyone has good technique, a lot of people do. It sounds like the special that you were watching was probably about counter punch KOs or something.

In both of those clips above the person "did something about it" by checking it. That is a defense for that kick. You bring your shin up so that instead of him kicking you in your meaty lower thing he kicks you in the strongest part of your shin bone, right below the knee. That is one of the most basic concepts in muay thai.
User avatar
#67 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Considering I've seen many times where the person has their arm behind the guy's neck, then when they pull it out instead of putting it in a position in front of the neck where you can quite fuckin easily make oxygen a problem for the other guy, they go ahead and do something else, they are absolutely unaware. That or, the strict Step 1 Step 2 drills that they all have don't include anything you can do from that angle.

And I think I've pointed out that what Muay Thai does which usually boils down to taking the full force of the hit in spot A or spot B is not exactly the most effective option.
#111 - drewjitsu (09/20/2015) [-]
Choke is a basic move, means usually one of the first learned. Means it is also first defense learned, loads of practice. Chokes can be hard because of that. Muay Thai doesn't teach to eat kicks. Leg kicks are checked, upper body kicks blocked or dodged. Seems like you're spouting out a bunch of theoretical stuff. Head kick takedown defense. Happens, but not often because of high risk (if you miss you're fucked). You talk about knockouts being a result of a missed punch/countered punch as if it is is a bad thing. Step one of landing a counter punch is the counter, parry or dodge. Both of those things will result in the other guy missing a punch. Your statement is like commenting that every time you've seen the sky with a pink/purple hue, the sun was rising or setting. You dont seem to factor in fatigue either.

Anyway, you come off as basement dwelling neckbeard who knows a thing or two about traditional martial arts and the theory of how they could be applied. You seem arrogant because you're lobbing criticism as the folks at the top of the food chain. Those people aren't in the spotlight because their fans voted them there. Those folks are in the spotlight because they won a shit ton of fights using what you've apparently found to be inadequate technique. I'm interested to know why they're the best in the world and you aren't. Get off of FJ and go win some titles! Make money!
User avatar
#144 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Okay, except you're ignoring the fact that everybody goes by the same technique. If one guy using inadequate technique beats a whole bunch of other people using inadequate technique, he's still using inadequate technique. And you seem to be completely missing the point I was talking about with the K.O. punches. My point there was that they quite often throw punches while leaving one side completely open by not having their non-punching hand in a position to defend themselves with it.

And by the way, that shit that they're doing in the GIFs absolutely amounts to eating the full force of the kick. Okay, they're using a harder spot to do it, but they're still taking 100% of the kick nonetheless. And then as for why hitting with the shin or flat of the foot isn't the most effective way to do it, answer this: When you swing a hammer, is it more effective to hit with the head of the hammer or the shaft?
#146 - drewjitsu (09/20/2015) [-]
There are pros and cons to every style, dude. There is no trump card. They don't all use the same technique. Most of them use similar techniques, but if there really were a one-style-beats-all, someone would have adopted it and started winning already. Hasn't really happened. The hammer thing: What's on the end of a hammer? solid hunk of metal. What's on the end of a leg? Foot with lots of small bones. Good risk of hurting your foot, that's why I don't like those kicks. However, they work well for some folks, just not me.

Also, that shit they're doing in the GIFs is breaking their opponents' leg in half so I think it works pretty fuckin' well. As someone who has done a little muay thai, however, checking a kick and eating one feel nothing alike. Checking also provides you a chance to throw your opponent off balance.

Defending whilst throwing: Keep off hand all blocky-blocky and roll the shoulder of punch hand. Shoulder protects jaw. That's what I see most of them doing before they gas. When fighters get tired, that can go out the window pretty quickly.

Lastly, though: If their technique is inadequate, why hasn't someone come in with your technique and risen to the top with little to no resistance?
#149 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Except what I'm talking about isn't the kicking with the top of the foot. I fully acknowledge that doing so is retarded and it is super easy to fuck someone up that does try and do that. But think about how you kick a soccer ball if you want it to really go far without giving a fuck about accuracy. What do you do? You kick it like you're swinging a hammer, as in with a straight foot connecting with your toes instead of the flat. Now kick a person like that instead of with your shin, and you're going from hitting the guy with a pole to striking them more precisely with a hammer. Of course you'll probably bring up the fact of mashing your toes, and to that I say that's why you pull your toes up albeit definitely need to be bent further than the person in the picture to connect with this part of the foot instead. Congratulations, you now have a for more penetrating roundhouse kick to really punch into those sensitive nerves and disable the guy immediately.
User avatar
#160 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
Kicking with the ball of your foot is a legitimate technique, we see it employed all the time in MMA. Its not as crippling as you're making it out to be, unless it lands in a vital spot in which case a kick with the shin will likely be as effective. Its also a much more difficult technique to successfully execute... using your example is it easier to hit a moving target with the head of a hammer or a baseball bat?
User avatar
#148 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Great points, especially the last one. Apparently everyone in the world is just learning the wrong technique except for this kid.
User avatar
#68 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
You've already demonstrated you know nothing about wrestling with your comment about head kicking your way out of takedowns. So I'd wager to say that in the fights you're watching you don't understand what is going on in the grappling exchanges.

What is a more effective striking style in a real fight than muay thai then? The magical striking style that only you and your father know from his (im just guessing here) undocumented fights in Kumite in Asia years ago? Is your father Frank Dux?
#134 - ainise (09/20/2015) [-]
Do any really effective fighting styles limit to one? Krav Maga, one of the more popular special ops fighting style for armies around the world (especially in the middle east) is a mixture of boxing techniques and grapples. You'll likely never see it in any ring, though, because it's intended to kill not pacify. Most of its moves are illegal in the ring, but you're talking real fights.

LINE is the Marine's special forces fighting style of choice. Again, it's intended to kill not pacify. It's a very brutal style overall and again, you'll never see it in an MMA ring.

Lerdrit is what the elite commandos of the Thai Royal Army use, which is basically Muay Thai + Muay Boran re-built with the intention to kill and with no rules. It's basically 1) Attack without warning, 2) Kill.

There are dozens of hidden weapon styles intended to quickly assassinate and kill a person. Some types of Ninjitsu, Many African arts, Most older Chinese non-competitive fighting styles, Silat, Okichitaw, etc.

For the ring, I'm pretty sure you're right. It's certainly one of the top 5 most popular fighting styles to learn in MMA, but for real fighting? There are no rules. The other guy can pull a knife, sword, gun, etc out on you. Even in its own country they didn't consider it good enough to stand on its own for unarmed fighting.
User avatar
#136 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
I'm more referring to the fact that he says muay thai isn't effective when it certainly is as far as a pure standup style goes.
User avatar
#109 - stickmanz (09/20/2015) [-]
I want to comment on how your observations seem lacking, but im a standing fighter who knows shit all so far about gappeling past the very basics so you know what, i'd like to hear why a head kick to a waist grab takedown doesn't work

i thumbed you back up so please don't flame me, im just trying to become a better fighter
#147 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Here is an example of a knee KO to an opponent shooting in for a takedown, Joachim Hansen vs Imanari. Great finish, one of the coolest ever, but still stuff like this is an exception and incredibly rare. (read my last three comments in reverse order so that they make some sense)
User avatar
#153 - stickmanz (09/21/2015) [-]
why was the other fighter that low, i can't tell what he's doing with that quality
User avatar
#156 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
Also, here is a link to the full fight in the above gif, Much better quality and you can see whats happening a lot better. Skip to around 3:30 for the KO if you don't wanna watch the whole thing.

www.dailymotion.com/video/xzrcm1_joachim-hansen-vs-masakazu-imanari_sport
#155 - nywrestler has deleted their comment.
#154 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
Shooting for a double leg takedown. Proper technique is to change levels and shoot in on the opponents legs in one swift motion and drive through them or L-cut and dump them to the side. Usually a wrestler will try to time their takedown like in this gif to the left here.
User avatar
#157 - stickmanz (09/21/2015) [-]
oh i understand then
User avatar
#158 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
To clarify from earlier, I'm not saying anything bad about any standup martial art or any type of martial art in general. I just don't like it when people start making stuff up as they go along like the guy was doing earlier. I don't like when people with no legitimate basis of knowledge or training think that they know how to fight or understand fighting better than people who do it professionally. He was literally saying that he knows how to grapple/choke better than people who have gold medals in national and world level grappling competitions.
User avatar
#159 - stickmanz (09/21/2015) [-]
Yo i feel you, thats why i try to never talk bigger than i can back up,
User avatar
#141 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Just to further expand on my last comment, a knee to an opponent shooting for a takedown is usually going to be much more effective than a kick because of how close the opponent will be after initiating the takedown. Still though, the timing and accuracy required is so exact that it is still going to be a low percentage move which will likely end up with missing or being a glancing blow and ending in a takedown.
User avatar
#135 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Just for the reason I said before, It can be effective and I've seen it happen many times, but a lot more likely is that you aren't going to get the KO and will just be off balance and easier to take down.
#46 - Except not really. The guys in those fights will get kicked li…  [+] (4 replies) 09/20/2015 on Don't worry I'm a doctor 0
User avatar
#50 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Have you not seen fights ended by those kicks? Have you not seen mobility impaired due to those kicks? I can link some for you if you want. Urijah Faber vs Jose Aldo comes immediately to mind.
User avatar
#137 - knifegun (09/20/2015) [-]
This guy needs to see Pedro Rizzo, Jose Aldo, Edson Barboza, Melvin Manhoef, and RDA, before he starts talking shit about the low roundhouse.
User avatar
#60 - CAPSEDDIE (09/20/2015) [-]
Nate Diaz vs RDA is also a good example
User avatar
#63 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Yep fucking brutal. Diaz could barely even move by the end of the fight.
#44 - Hence why that kick is immensely ******* retarded.  [+] (35 replies) 09/20/2015 on Don't worry I'm a doctor 0
User avatar
#45 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Its an insanely rare thing to break your shin like that, even if the kick gets checked though. Leg kicks like that are really effective. You're much, much more likely to break your hand by throwing any kind of punch.
User avatar
#49 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Just like the kicking with the flat of the foot. If you hit the outer reaches of their foot with a solid elbow going in the opposite direction, that foot is fucked. It's just lucky that in MMA everyone follows the exact same procedures without improvising. well, mostly. On the odd ocassion that someone accidentally does something not included in the designated step 1 step 2 guides, it usually ends up in a pretty fast victory.
User avatar
#51 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
That seems somewhat condescending to MMA fighters. Almost like you're implying that you know of some better more effective form of fighting than people who actually fight professionally know... care to elaborate?
User avatar
#58 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Actually, yea, I do. From my dad who did 50 competitive fights over in Asia before martial arts were Westernised and became a thing of show business. He even went to Muay Thai fighters which is where UFC got that shit from , and observed how they could take a ton of those kicks in the leg and still be fighting, whereas using his own kick connecting with what we call the ball of the foot, place one into the sensitive area on the outside of the thigh and, even with all their conditioning, none of said Muay Thai fighters could take more than one kick.

And then as for the rest of the stupid procedures that UFC is locked into, my favourite part is how they miss almost every opportunity to choke the guy that presents itself. To the point where they'll even have their arm barely more than a twitch away from the spot where they'd need to put it to choke the person, but they'll go for some other convoluted counter instead.

Or how the standard counter to a guy diving towards your midsection to take you down is apparently to let them grab you then go into dumb grappling crap, rather than responding with a swift kick to the top of the head for a likely K.O. or at least to the face to rattle them.

Or in a special I watched that was showing multiple clips of people getting K.O.d by a punch to the head, EVERY. SINGLE. ONE. occurred because fighter A throws a punch and either misses or grazes, then fighter B comes in with a counter punch that goes straight into fighter A's jaw because when A threw his punch, he for some stupid reason saw fit to leave his other hand all the way down by his waist because who needs to keep themselves properly defended, right?

And then more about those kicks, it seems that according to UFC they're the ultimate move since it's pretty rare to see someone actually do something about it other than just standing there and taking it. Considering the wind-up and the usual lack of guard as seen in that GIF, guy's face is wide open during the kick and probably was for a full 2 seconds before the GIF starts , you have plenty of time to either leap in and bash the guy, or bend to soften the blow and grab the guy's leg, or just back out of range if you're already far back and then pounce immediately after.
#69 - ainise (09/20/2015) [-]
I mean..look at the rules. All of the proper responses to that low kick are fucking illegal.

If I were fit and capable to reason inside the ring, my response to that low kick would be to either step in and use my knee on the inside of his thigh/knee & follow up with a punch or to simply return a kick with my right leg to his kidney...

Both of which are illegal. And that's why I always had trouble getting into fighting sports. It's just not a real fight. When you grapple someone in a real fight, the quickest way to end the fight is a hammerfist to a vital organ, but every part of that is illegal in the ring - mind you that's for good reason, but it's just not a real fight.

The fundamental of many of martial arts is to end the fight with as few injuries to yourself as possible. As such, you aim for much more dangerous attacks. Neck, nose, solar plexus, knees, kidneys, etc. You use much more dangerous attacks, like Hammerfists, Gouging, hooking, Spiking, Cranks, Headbutts, Violent Grapples, etc.

Asian Martial Arts, on the other hand, is much more underground. China and Vietnam are famous for both being dangerous places to fight in, as a lot of their rules are(or at least were when I last researched this) much more laxed and a much MUCH higher rate of injury exists there. So that can be a lot of what you're seeing.
User avatar
#138 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
A kick to the kidney or a knee to the thigh are not illegal in MMA. People get dropped and finished by kidney shots or liver shots all the time.

Do you have any sources where I can read about or watch these underground Asian martial arts fights? Sounds really interesting.
#143 - ainise (09/20/2015) [-]
Illegal Actions:
"Strikes to the neck, throat, spine, kidneys, joints, groin, knees and below"

This appears to be the amateur MMA rules - my mistake.

As for watching illegal fighting matches..well it's not easy to find and it's even harder to stomach some of those fights. I happened across a video site on mIRC back in the day...the fights were a bit...gruesome. I'm sure there gambling sites for underground fights today, but with the Chinese government's attitude on internet, I'd be surprised if they got out of the country.

If they do exist, you'd have to find em on the dark web.
User avatar
#91 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
You present a much better argument than anyone else I have come across. I can easily argue better counters because, despite what most MMA fanboys claim, there are a shitload of things you can do that are vastly more effective. But if the rules restrict anyone from being allowed to do those things, then not really anything I can say other than those rules are dumb from my perspective.

Those responses are exactly along the lines of what I'd say to do, and I'm of the same mind where I feel like it's more of a glorified and restricted bar room brawl than highly skilful fighting. And that underground shit is the type of thing that my dad did when he was travelling through Asia with the NZ navy his commanding officer let him pursue the fighting/martial arts stuff after catching wind of a scuffle between my dad and a few gang members specialising in brutally attacking people in uniform. Was him against 7 guys, he knocked out two of them and broke the leader's collarbone to make the guy scream, scaring off the rest of them. . The rules were no nutshots and no eye gouges, but even if you broke the rules the other guy only had like 5 minutes or something to recover, and if he wasn't able to continue the fight after those 5 minutes then you won anyway.
User avatar
#62 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Not going to comment on the stuff about your dad fighting history or your insane fighting skillz because I don't know you or your dad so I'll just say "ok".

To your point about the choking opportunities, these are the same guys that do national and world level grappling competitions. Some of them are literally among the greatest grapplers on the planet, as evidenced by national/world level grappling competitions like Abu Dhabi, IBJJF world championships, Pan Am games, etc. I can tell you they are well aware of any chokes that are available to them.

As for the swift kick to the top of the head thing, you realize that if you don't connect with that kick and knock them out that you are definitely going to get taken down. A knee to the jaw will work too, but again you are sacrificing a ton of balance to do either of the those things and basically conceding the takedown. Regardless most times you aren't going to knock someone out with a kick or a knee because its not a high success rate move. That's why in most cases people do that "dumb grapping" crap as you put it, also known as wrestling. You're much less likely to end up on your back.

Keeping your hands up is an integral part of boxing and MMA. Good technique is to keep your hands up and defend yourself. Not everyone has good technique, a lot of people do. It sounds like the special that you were watching was probably about counter punch KOs or something.

In both of those clips above the person "did something about it" by checking it. That is a defense for that kick. You bring your shin up so that instead of him kicking you in your meaty lower thing he kicks you in the strongest part of your shin bone, right below the knee. That is one of the most basic concepts in muay thai.
User avatar
#67 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Considering I've seen many times where the person has their arm behind the guy's neck, then when they pull it out instead of putting it in a position in front of the neck where you can quite fuckin easily make oxygen a problem for the other guy, they go ahead and do something else, they are absolutely unaware. That or, the strict Step 1 Step 2 drills that they all have don't include anything you can do from that angle.

And I think I've pointed out that what Muay Thai does which usually boils down to taking the full force of the hit in spot A or spot B is not exactly the most effective option.
#111 - drewjitsu (09/20/2015) [-]
Choke is a basic move, means usually one of the first learned. Means it is also first defense learned, loads of practice. Chokes can be hard because of that. Muay Thai doesn't teach to eat kicks. Leg kicks are checked, upper body kicks blocked or dodged. Seems like you're spouting out a bunch of theoretical stuff. Head kick takedown defense. Happens, but not often because of high risk (if you miss you're fucked). You talk about knockouts being a result of a missed punch/countered punch as if it is is a bad thing. Step one of landing a counter punch is the counter, parry or dodge. Both of those things will result in the other guy missing a punch. Your statement is like commenting that every time you've seen the sky with a pink/purple hue, the sun was rising or setting. You dont seem to factor in fatigue either.

Anyway, you come off as basement dwelling neckbeard who knows a thing or two about traditional martial arts and the theory of how they could be applied. You seem arrogant because you're lobbing criticism as the folks at the top of the food chain. Those people aren't in the spotlight because their fans voted them there. Those folks are in the spotlight because they won a shit ton of fights using what you've apparently found to be inadequate technique. I'm interested to know why they're the best in the world and you aren't. Get off of FJ and go win some titles! Make money!
User avatar
#144 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Okay, except you're ignoring the fact that everybody goes by the same technique. If one guy using inadequate technique beats a whole bunch of other people using inadequate technique, he's still using inadequate technique. And you seem to be completely missing the point I was talking about with the K.O. punches. My point there was that they quite often throw punches while leaving one side completely open by not having their non-punching hand in a position to defend themselves with it.

And by the way, that shit that they're doing in the GIFs absolutely amounts to eating the full force of the kick. Okay, they're using a harder spot to do it, but they're still taking 100% of the kick nonetheless. And then as for why hitting with the shin or flat of the foot isn't the most effective way to do it, answer this: When you swing a hammer, is it more effective to hit with the head of the hammer or the shaft?
#146 - drewjitsu (09/20/2015) [-]
There are pros and cons to every style, dude. There is no trump card. They don't all use the same technique. Most of them use similar techniques, but if there really were a one-style-beats-all, someone would have adopted it and started winning already. Hasn't really happened. The hammer thing: What's on the end of a hammer? solid hunk of metal. What's on the end of a leg? Foot with lots of small bones. Good risk of hurting your foot, that's why I don't like those kicks. However, they work well for some folks, just not me.

Also, that shit they're doing in the GIFs is breaking their opponents' leg in half so I think it works pretty fuckin' well. As someone who has done a little muay thai, however, checking a kick and eating one feel nothing alike. Checking also provides you a chance to throw your opponent off balance.

Defending whilst throwing: Keep off hand all blocky-blocky and roll the shoulder of punch hand. Shoulder protects jaw. That's what I see most of them doing before they gas. When fighters get tired, that can go out the window pretty quickly.

Lastly, though: If their technique is inadequate, why hasn't someone come in with your technique and risen to the top with little to no resistance?
#149 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Except what I'm talking about isn't the kicking with the top of the foot. I fully acknowledge that doing so is retarded and it is super easy to fuck someone up that does try and do that. But think about how you kick a soccer ball if you want it to really go far without giving a fuck about accuracy. What do you do? You kick it like you're swinging a hammer, as in with a straight foot connecting with your toes instead of the flat. Now kick a person like that instead of with your shin, and you're going from hitting the guy with a pole to striking them more precisely with a hammer. Of course you'll probably bring up the fact of mashing your toes, and to that I say that's why you pull your toes up albeit definitely need to be bent further than the person in the picture to connect with this part of the foot instead. Congratulations, you now have a for more penetrating roundhouse kick to really punch into those sensitive nerves and disable the guy immediately.
User avatar
#160 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
Kicking with the ball of your foot is a legitimate technique, we see it employed all the time in MMA. Its not as crippling as you're making it out to be, unless it lands in a vital spot in which case a kick with the shin will likely be as effective. Its also a much more difficult technique to successfully execute... using your example is it easier to hit a moving target with the head of a hammer or a baseball bat?
User avatar
#148 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Great points, especially the last one. Apparently everyone in the world is just learning the wrong technique except for this kid.
User avatar
#68 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
You've already demonstrated you know nothing about wrestling with your comment about head kicking your way out of takedowns. So I'd wager to say that in the fights you're watching you don't understand what is going on in the grappling exchanges.

What is a more effective striking style in a real fight than muay thai then? The magical striking style that only you and your father know from his (im just guessing here) undocumented fights in Kumite in Asia years ago? Is your father Frank Dux?
#134 - ainise (09/20/2015) [-]
Do any really effective fighting styles limit to one? Krav Maga, one of the more popular special ops fighting style for armies around the world (especially in the middle east) is a mixture of boxing techniques and grapples. You'll likely never see it in any ring, though, because it's intended to kill not pacify. Most of its moves are illegal in the ring, but you're talking real fights.

LINE is the Marine's special forces fighting style of choice. Again, it's intended to kill not pacify. It's a very brutal style overall and again, you'll never see it in an MMA ring.

Lerdrit is what the elite commandos of the Thai Royal Army use, which is basically Muay Thai + Muay Boran re-built with the intention to kill and with no rules. It's basically 1) Attack without warning, 2) Kill.

There are dozens of hidden weapon styles intended to quickly assassinate and kill a person. Some types of Ninjitsu, Many African arts, Most older Chinese non-competitive fighting styles, Silat, Okichitaw, etc.

For the ring, I'm pretty sure you're right. It's certainly one of the top 5 most popular fighting styles to learn in MMA, but for real fighting? There are no rules. The other guy can pull a knife, sword, gun, etc out on you. Even in its own country they didn't consider it good enough to stand on its own for unarmed fighting.
User avatar
#136 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
I'm more referring to the fact that he says muay thai isn't effective when it certainly is as far as a pure standup style goes.
User avatar
#109 - stickmanz (09/20/2015) [-]
I want to comment on how your observations seem lacking, but im a standing fighter who knows shit all so far about gappeling past the very basics so you know what, i'd like to hear why a head kick to a waist grab takedown doesn't work

i thumbed you back up so please don't flame me, im just trying to become a better fighter
#147 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Here is an example of a knee KO to an opponent shooting in for a takedown, Joachim Hansen vs Imanari. Great finish, one of the coolest ever, but still stuff like this is an exception and incredibly rare. (read my last three comments in reverse order so that they make some sense)
User avatar
#153 - stickmanz (09/21/2015) [-]
why was the other fighter that low, i can't tell what he's doing with that quality
User avatar
#156 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
Also, here is a link to the full fight in the above gif, Much better quality and you can see whats happening a lot better. Skip to around 3:30 for the KO if you don't wanna watch the whole thing.

www.dailymotion.com/video/xzrcm1_joachim-hansen-vs-masakazu-imanari_sport
#155 - nywrestler has deleted their comment.
#154 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
Shooting for a double leg takedown. Proper technique is to change levels and shoot in on the opponents legs in one swift motion and drive through them or L-cut and dump them to the side. Usually a wrestler will try to time their takedown like in this gif to the left here.
User avatar
#157 - stickmanz (09/21/2015) [-]
oh i understand then
User avatar
#158 - nywrestler (09/21/2015) [-]
To clarify from earlier, I'm not saying anything bad about any standup martial art or any type of martial art in general. I just don't like it when people start making stuff up as they go along like the guy was doing earlier. I don't like when people with no legitimate basis of knowledge or training think that they know how to fight or understand fighting better than people who do it professionally. He was literally saying that he knows how to grapple/choke better than people who have gold medals in national and world level grappling competitions.
User avatar
#159 - stickmanz (09/21/2015) [-]
Yo i feel you, thats why i try to never talk bigger than i can back up,
User avatar
#141 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Just to further expand on my last comment, a knee to an opponent shooting for a takedown is usually going to be much more effective than a kick because of how close the opponent will be after initiating the takedown. Still though, the timing and accuracy required is so exact that it is still going to be a low percentage move which will likely end up with missing or being a glancing blow and ending in a takedown.
User avatar
#135 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Just for the reason I said before, It can be effective and I've seen it happen many times, but a lot more likely is that you aren't going to get the KO and will just be off balance and easier to take down.
User avatar
#46 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Except not really. The guys in those fights will get kicked like 20 times like that and still be on their feet fighting. Sure, the next day they're gonna have troubles walking but that's useless since you need them to be having leg issues immediately after the kick, not 12 hours after.

Those kicks are worthless.
User avatar
#50 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Have you not seen fights ended by those kicks? Have you not seen mobility impaired due to those kicks? I can link some for you if you want. Urijah Faber vs Jose Aldo comes immediately to mind.
User avatar
#137 - knifegun (09/20/2015) [-]
This guy needs to see Pedro Rizzo, Jose Aldo, Edson Barboza, Melvin Manhoef, and RDA, before he starts talking shit about the low roundhouse.
User avatar
#60 - CAPSEDDIE (09/20/2015) [-]
Nate Diaz vs RDA is also a good example
User avatar
#63 - nywrestler (09/20/2015) [-]
Yep fucking brutal. Diaz could barely even move by the end of the fight.
#86 - Then explain why PC gamers are so much more anal about resolut…  [+] (3 replies) 09/20/2015 on How to fandom +1
#89 - ilikepatatas (09/20/2015) [-]
nowadays, where other than content like this have you seen pcfags getting anal about graphics,like seriously
and from the ones you've seen have you confirmed they are pcfags?
like even the majority of the ones you've seen counts
i personally haven't seen pcgamers complain because mods fix all that
all i've seen are consolefags because they're stuck with the same graphics
User avatar
#91 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Just look at GTA IV, if pc gamers really don't care about graphics that much, then why would they go through the effort of modding a game that isn't designed to be modded in order to put an assload of work into increasing the graphical quality?

Console gamers generally just take what they get and don't complain. It's pc where all the graphics fanatics are
User avatar
#90 - hydraetis (09/20/2015) [-]
Just the fact that all those mods exist prove that PC gamers care a fucking lot about graphics