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Date Signed Up:1/20/2012
Last Login:11/21/2014
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Highest Content Rank:#2238
Highest Comment Rank:#266
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latest user's comments

#5 - eventually...  [+] (3 new replies) 10/17/2014 on Death from the shadows +3
#6 - dudesname (10/17/2014) [-]
oooh, ooooh, that's infinity's column, by constantin brancusi
#7 - beerholder (10/17/2014) [-]
Swell with Voevods and gypsies
#8 - dudesname (10/17/2014) [-]
ROMANIA STRONK
#11 - Hurry Ivan we will miss air battle.jpg don't f… 10/17/2014 on Im gonna be late on the way... 0
#2 - Orwell described communism, and communism was pretty much like that. 10/15/2014 on repôsting old shit 8 +3
#217 - Yeah, but this should have happened in 1989 after the retreat … 10/15/2014 on IM SO POLOTICAL Sfafd +1
#214 - I completely agree with you, capitalism is good, and I'm sayin…  [+] (2 new replies) 10/15/2014 on IM SO POLOTICAL Sfafd 0
User avatar #215 - damping (10/15/2014) [-]
We do build schools for them. That is why it takes a while for them to like us. It starts with the kids. The bigger problem is the terrorists blowing up the schools.
#217 - beerholder (10/15/2014) [-]
Yeah, but this should have happened in 1989 after the retreat of the soviets from Afghanistan. Back then, 80% of the population was made of young people. You've left them brooding for 20 years, and now it's a mess of religious extremism and secular cultural aversion. And this is going to take a long, long time to fix.
#211 - The US doesn't annex territories, but they enforce changes in …  [+] (4 new replies) 10/15/2014 on IM SO POLOTICAL Sfafd 0
User avatar #212 - damping (10/15/2014) [-]
They should be forced into Capitalism and Democracy. I'm just saying, they may hate us in the near future, but when they finally get it together, they will thank us.
#214 - beerholder (10/15/2014) [-]
I completely agree with you, capitalism is good, and I'm saying this as a citizen of a formerly communist country. But... people need to know why capitalism is good.

It's not something that is presented in a 2-ply brochure you pass it to the people. You need to rebuild their schools, pave their roads and enhance their standard of living in order to make people enthusiastic about capitalism. As I said earlier, those people don't have CNN to tell them the perks of capitalism, most of them don't even have electricity. When you bombed their goats and decimated their family, how are they to see that you wish their good?
User avatar #215 - damping (10/15/2014) [-]
We do build schools for them. That is why it takes a while for them to like us. It starts with the kids. The bigger problem is the terrorists blowing up the schools.
#217 - beerholder (10/15/2014) [-]
Yeah, but this should have happened in 1989 after the retreat of the soviets from Afghanistan. Back then, 80% of the population was made of young people. You've left them brooding for 20 years, and now it's a mess of religious extremism and secular cultural aversion. And this is going to take a long, long time to fix.
#69 - What I'm saying is that if you look at the process of changing…  [+] (6 new replies) 10/14/2014 on IM SO POLOTICAL Sfafd 0
User avatar #204 - damping (10/15/2014) [-]
Except the Romans took their land and made them part of the empire. We are not making the countries we invaded part of the US.

Funny how a number of the countries we invaded and occupied are some of our biggest fans. (Philippines, Japan, South Korea, Vietnam, France, Kenya)

www.pewglobal.org/database/indicator/1/
#211 - beerholder (10/15/2014) [-]
The US doesn't annex territories, but they enforce changes in political structures. Japan changed from a militaristic semi-feudal state to a capitalistic state, and the people had no saying in that decision. The same went with South Korea or West Germany.

After the defeat of the Taliban dictatorship, democracy was established pretty much because the Americans decided that. Even though it would seem to be natural choice, when it comes to governing themselves, a lot of people would choose to return to a state of earlier monarchy or even become communist.

The point of that comparison wasn't on the political strategies, but on the social strategies chosen by the Roman Empire (or Republic) and the US toward their vanquished foes.
User avatar #212 - damping (10/15/2014) [-]
They should be forced into Capitalism and Democracy. I'm just saying, they may hate us in the near future, but when they finally get it together, they will thank us.
#214 - beerholder (10/15/2014) [-]
I completely agree with you, capitalism is good, and I'm saying this as a citizen of a formerly communist country. But... people need to know why capitalism is good.

It's not something that is presented in a 2-ply brochure you pass it to the people. You need to rebuild their schools, pave their roads and enhance their standard of living in order to make people enthusiastic about capitalism. As I said earlier, those people don't have CNN to tell them the perks of capitalism, most of them don't even have electricity. When you bombed their goats and decimated their family, how are they to see that you wish their good?
User avatar #215 - damping (10/15/2014) [-]
We do build schools for them. That is why it takes a while for them to like us. It starts with the kids. The bigger problem is the terrorists blowing up the schools.
#217 - beerholder (10/15/2014) [-]
Yeah, but this should have happened in 1989 after the retreat of the soviets from Afghanistan. Back then, 80% of the population was made of young people. You've left them brooding for 20 years, and now it's a mess of religious extremism and secular cultural aversion. And this is going to take a long, long time to fix.
#64 - Well, looking at how Bin-Laden did it would clear it up. He wa…  [+] (1 new reply) 10/14/2014 on IM SO POLOTICAL Sfafd 0
#105 - yodawgiheard (10/15/2014) [-]
Yup. What confuses people is why we're still in Afghanistan and Iraq. Infrastructure. People aren't likely to be extremists if they live in conditions that are better than what tey lived in before under religious extremist warlords. At least, that's the plan.

What's always irked me about the whining about the war is two things. First, that it's about the oil. If we just wanted oil, we could just TAKE that shit. It'd be so easy to come in, take control of the wells, set up some shell companies that are supported by the US, and take the oil. That's not hard. Second, is the idea that we're practicing "American Imperialism". This one's got a bit of truth to it. We are trying to set the table for governments that are more Western than Islamic Fundamentalist, that's true. What's lost is that we're actually owning up to our destruction of the existing infrastructure and trying to improve the countries that we are in. If we were to take our cues from European imperialism in Africa, we'd just take control of the valuable resources, the locals would be pissed at our puppet government and rebel, we'd leave, keeping most of the economic power for ourselves, and just let the countries devolve into civil war. After all, after destroying the previous government and then establishing our own, once you remove that established government without a plan for the locals, there's a power vacuum waiting to be filled with various leaders, usually all at once, which causes conflict. We're actually staying around to pick up the pieces of the countries that we are in, trying to piece it together to make them better (and at the same time more beneficial towards the Western world, thus the Imperialism part), which really hasn't been done since Japan/Korea.
#46 - What the parable says is that you shouldn't pre-decide if a th…  [+] (10 new replies) 10/14/2014 on IM SO POLOTICAL Sfafd 0
#49 - widar (10/14/2014) [-]
I don't think Bin Laden would have not turned into an enemy of the US if the US had poured more money into Afghanistan after the Soviet war there. That's not how religious extremism works, before they intervened in Afghanistan the Soviets put huge sums of aid into that country to build up an infrastructure etc and help the socialist government there. All that help did not gain them any gratitude from the Mujahideen who tried to turn the country into a theocracy anyway, which was the whole reason for the intervention over the course of which the Soviets destroyed all the infrastructure they themselves had paid for.
It's just a bad, really really bad idea to fund groups like that. It will not ever turn out well.
#69 - beerholder (10/14/2014) [-]
What I'm saying is that if you look at the process of changing a culture, you can look back at how the Romans won the hearts and minds of the vanquished barbarians:

- boo, we hate you and we think your Roman policies are detrimental to our culture
- have you seen how we live?
- yeah, you have sewers and schools and paved roads
- would you like to have these things?
- I guess they're pretty neat, yeah
- would you like us to help you have those kind of things?
- sure!

2 generations later, the whole tribe speaks latin

How Americans did it:
- boo, we hate you and we think your western policies are detrimental to our culture
- have you seen how we live?
- yeah, you have sewers and schools and paved roads
- would you like to have these things?
- I guess they're pretty neat, yeah
- well fuckin' do them you're on your own! Love us!

2 generations later, the resentment for US culture manifests as terrorism.

Roman Empire 1 - US - 0

It didn't worked all the time, but they tried
User avatar #204 - damping (10/15/2014) [-]
Except the Romans took their land and made them part of the empire. We are not making the countries we invaded part of the US.

Funny how a number of the countries we invaded and occupied are some of our biggest fans. (Philippines, Japan, South Korea, Vietnam, France, Kenya)

www.pewglobal.org/database/indicator/1/
#211 - beerholder (10/15/2014) [-]
The US doesn't annex territories, but they enforce changes in political structures. Japan changed from a militaristic semi-feudal state to a capitalistic state, and the people had no saying in that decision. The same went with South Korea or West Germany.

After the defeat of the Taliban dictatorship, democracy was established pretty much because the Americans decided that. Even though it would seem to be natural choice, when it comes to governing themselves, a lot of people would choose to return to a state of earlier monarchy or even become communist.

The point of that comparison wasn't on the political strategies, but on the social strategies chosen by the Roman Empire (or Republic) and the US toward their vanquished foes.
User avatar #212 - damping (10/15/2014) [-]
They should be forced into Capitalism and Democracy. I'm just saying, they may hate us in the near future, but when they finally get it together, they will thank us.
#214 - beerholder (10/15/2014) [-]
I completely agree with you, capitalism is good, and I'm saying this as a citizen of a formerly communist country. But... people need to know why capitalism is good.

It's not something that is presented in a 2-ply brochure you pass it to the people. You need to rebuild their schools, pave their roads and enhance their standard of living in order to make people enthusiastic about capitalism. As I said earlier, those people don't have CNN to tell them the perks of capitalism, most of them don't even have electricity. When you bombed their goats and decimated their family, how are they to see that you wish their good?
User avatar #215 - damping (10/15/2014) [-]
We do build schools for them. That is why it takes a while for them to like us. It starts with the kids. The bigger problem is the terrorists blowing up the schools.
#217 - beerholder (10/15/2014) [-]
Yeah, but this should have happened in 1989 after the retreat of the soviets from Afghanistan. Back then, 80% of the population was made of young people. You've left them brooding for 20 years, and now it's a mess of religious extremism and secular cultural aversion. And this is going to take a long, long time to fix.
#64 - beerholder (10/14/2014) [-]
Well, looking at how Bin-Laden did it would clear it up. He was a Saudi, he funded the Afghans through Pakistan the same way the Americans did, but after the war ended, he stayed and turned these disillusioned people and against the Americans. He used his image as a hero of Jihad against the soviets and built his army on that credibility. Those people weren't inherently extremists, but religious extremism was just the leverage he needed and used, because it was very easy to recruit young people from mosques by paying some imams to send people to his cause. And since at that time 80% of the population of Afghanistan was made of young people under 30 and without an education, this was extremely easy to do.

If the Americans helped Afghans rebuild after the war and provided them with schools and infrastructure, people could have been less disgruntled and less likely to sway into the terrorist clique. It is basically what they're trying to do now.
#105 - yodawgiheard (10/15/2014) [-]
Yup. What confuses people is why we're still in Afghanistan and Iraq. Infrastructure. People aren't likely to be extremists if they live in conditions that are better than what tey lived in before under religious extremist warlords. At least, that's the plan.

What's always irked me about the whining about the war is two things. First, that it's about the oil. If we just wanted oil, we could just TAKE that shit. It'd be so easy to come in, take control of the wells, set up some shell companies that are supported by the US, and take the oil. That's not hard. Second, is the idea that we're practicing "American Imperialism". This one's got a bit of truth to it. We are trying to set the table for governments that are more Western than Islamic Fundamentalist, that's true. What's lost is that we're actually owning up to our destruction of the existing infrastructure and trying to improve the countries that we are in. If we were to take our cues from European imperialism in Africa, we'd just take control of the valuable resources, the locals would be pissed at our puppet government and rebel, we'd leave, keeping most of the economic power for ourselves, and just let the countries devolve into civil war. After all, after destroying the previous government and then establishing our own, once you remove that established government without a plan for the locals, there's a power vacuum waiting to be filled with various leaders, usually all at once, which causes conflict. We're actually staying around to pick up the pieces of the countries that we are in, trying to piece it together to make them better (and at the same time more beneficial towards the Western world, thus the Imperialism part), which really hasn't been done since Japan/Korea.
#33 - There's a little boy and on his 14th birthday he gets a horse.…  [+] (13 new replies) 10/14/2014 on IM SO POLOTICAL Sfafd +8
#47 - widar (10/14/2014) [-]
Dude. Dude. How is it not a completely predictable outcome to create a powerful jihadist group when you arm and train jihadists? And you did the exact same thing 30 years ago and are now in the 14th year of war against that group you had trained?
#45 - mattymc (10/14/2014) [-]
so what you're saying is, we dont know the definitive outcome of any situation beacuase what happens next can instantly change our perspective?
#46 - beerholder (10/14/2014) [-]
What the parable says is that you shouldn't pre-decide if a thing is good or not, you need to keep a sense of vigilance on the possible outcome.

The quote is from Charlie Wilson's War, a movie about the US financing of the Afghans in their fight with the Russians. The idea is that if you don't follow through with helping these people after the war, they'll return to their burnt homes, their broken roads and destroyed schools, and some of them will feel cheated. They'll feel that they were abandoned, and your purpose was not to help them, but to use them as cannon fodder against your enemies. And that could make them very upset. In the west, people might see that you helped them, but they don't have CNN to tell them that, they only have an improvised tent and a malnourished goat.

#49 - widar (10/14/2014) [-]
I don't think Bin Laden would have not turned into an enemy of the US if the US had poured more money into Afghanistan after the Soviet war there. That's not how religious extremism works, before they intervened in Afghanistan the Soviets put huge sums of aid into that country to build up an infrastructure etc and help the socialist government there. All that help did not gain them any gratitude from the Mujahideen who tried to turn the country into a theocracy anyway, which was the whole reason for the intervention over the course of which the Soviets destroyed all the infrastructure they themselves had paid for.
It's just a bad, really really bad idea to fund groups like that. It will not ever turn out well.
#69 - beerholder (10/14/2014) [-]
What I'm saying is that if you look at the process of changing a culture, you can look back at how the Romans won the hearts and minds of the vanquished barbarians:

- boo, we hate you and we think your Roman policies are detrimental to our culture
- have you seen how we live?
- yeah, you have sewers and schools and paved roads
- would you like to have these things?
- I guess they're pretty neat, yeah
- would you like us to help you have those kind of things?
- sure!

2 generations later, the whole tribe speaks latin

How Americans did it:
- boo, we hate you and we think your western policies are detrimental to our culture
- have you seen how we live?
- yeah, you have sewers and schools and paved roads
- would you like to have these things?
- I guess they're pretty neat, yeah
- well fuckin' do them you're on your own! Love us!

2 generations later, the resentment for US culture manifests as terrorism.

Roman Empire 1 - US - 0

It didn't worked all the time, but they tried
User avatar #204 - damping (10/15/2014) [-]
Except the Romans took their land and made them part of the empire. We are not making the countries we invaded part of the US.

Funny how a number of the countries we invaded and occupied are some of our biggest fans. (Philippines, Japan, South Korea, Vietnam, France, Kenya)

www.pewglobal.org/database/indicator/1/
#211 - beerholder (10/15/2014) [-]
The US doesn't annex territories, but they enforce changes in political structures. Japan changed from a militaristic semi-feudal state to a capitalistic state, and the people had no saying in that decision. The same went with South Korea or West Germany.

After the defeat of the Taliban dictatorship, democracy was established pretty much because the Americans decided that. Even though it would seem to be natural choice, when it comes to governing themselves, a lot of people would choose to return to a state of earlier monarchy or even become communist.

The point of that comparison wasn't on the political strategies, but on the social strategies chosen by the Roman Empire (or Republic) and the US toward their vanquished foes.
User avatar #212 - damping (10/15/2014) [-]
They should be forced into Capitalism and Democracy. I'm just saying, they may hate us in the near future, but when they finally get it together, they will thank us.
#214 - beerholder (10/15/2014) [-]
I completely agree with you, capitalism is good, and I'm saying this as a citizen of a formerly communist country. But... people need to know why capitalism is good.

It's not something that is presented in a 2-ply brochure you pass it to the people. You need to rebuild their schools, pave their roads and enhance their standard of living in order to make people enthusiastic about capitalism. As I said earlier, those people don't have CNN to tell them the perks of capitalism, most of them don't even have electricity. When you bombed their goats and decimated their family, how are they to see that you wish their good?
User avatar #215 - damping (10/15/2014) [-]
We do build schools for them. That is why it takes a while for them to like us. It starts with the kids. The bigger problem is the terrorists blowing up the schools.
#217 - beerholder (10/15/2014) [-]
Yeah, but this should have happened in 1989 after the retreat of the soviets from Afghanistan. Back then, 80% of the population was made of young people. You've left them brooding for 20 years, and now it's a mess of religious extremism and secular cultural aversion. And this is going to take a long, long time to fix.
#64 - beerholder (10/14/2014) [-]
Well, looking at how Bin-Laden did it would clear it up. He was a Saudi, he funded the Afghans through Pakistan the same way the Americans did, but after the war ended, he stayed and turned these disillusioned people and against the Americans. He used his image as a hero of Jihad against the soviets and built his army on that credibility. Those people weren't inherently extremists, but religious extremism was just the leverage he needed and used, because it was very easy to recruit young people from mosques by paying some imams to send people to his cause. And since at that time 80% of the population of Afghanistan was made of young people under 30 and without an education, this was extremely easy to do.

If the Americans helped Afghans rebuild after the war and provided them with schools and infrastructure, people could have been less disgruntled and less likely to sway into the terrorist clique. It is basically what they're trying to do now.
#105 - yodawgiheard (10/15/2014) [-]
Yup. What confuses people is why we're still in Afghanistan and Iraq. Infrastructure. People aren't likely to be extremists if they live in conditions that are better than what tey lived in before under religious extremist warlords. At least, that's the plan.

What's always irked me about the whining about the war is two things. First, that it's about the oil. If we just wanted oil, we could just TAKE that shit. It'd be so easy to come in, take control of the wells, set up some shell companies that are supported by the US, and take the oil. That's not hard. Second, is the idea that we're practicing "American Imperialism". This one's got a bit of truth to it. We are trying to set the table for governments that are more Western than Islamic Fundamentalist, that's true. What's lost is that we're actually owning up to our destruction of the existing infrastructure and trying to improve the countries that we are in. If we were to take our cues from European imperialism in Africa, we'd just take control of the valuable resources, the locals would be pissed at our puppet government and rebel, we'd leave, keeping most of the economic power for ourselves, and just let the countries devolve into civil war. After all, after destroying the previous government and then establishing our own, once you remove that established government without a plan for the locals, there's a power vacuum waiting to be filled with various leaders, usually all at once, which causes conflict. We're actually staying around to pick up the pieces of the countries that we are in, trying to piece it together to make them better (and at the same time more beneficial towards the Western world, thus the Imperialism part), which really hasn't been done since Japan/Korea.
#1 - Comment deleted 10/13/2014 on I’ve Seen Enough Hentai... 0
#5 - Before death came, the liars were made to feast upon… 10/10/2014 on quotes 0
#38 - So you'll get them back like a man! What's the matter with you… 10/10/2014 on Missing stuff? 0
#12 - Typing furiously as windows 98 runs the checkdisk. 09/29/2014 on Good Job Daily Mail +6
#26 - Well, have you heard of Poseidon since? You're ******* … 09/29/2014 on War. Huh, What is it good... 0
#39 - Yeah, and when I thought food posting was bad, we'll soon hav… 09/25/2014 on This some future shit right... +5
#36 - Culture is pretty much a set of ideals that people identify wi… 09/25/2014 on I'm not the onley one 0
#1 - News from tomorrows front page: the saving private ry…  [+] (3 new replies) 09/24/2014 on Camouflage +2
#3 - zeroqp (09/24/2014) [-]
**zeroqp rolled image** or not
#2 - futaprincess (09/24/2014) [-]
#6 - zahidlol (09/25/2014) [-]
#349 - Medieval 2 Total War and Mount&Blade Warband. It… 09/23/2014 on ? 0
#75 - I know how it's spelled, I went to Stockholm last summer and v… 09/22/2014 on dirty business 0
#72 - lol yeah, I have a tendency of calling it Noble instead of Nob…  [+] (2 new replies) 09/22/2014 on dirty business 0
User avatar #73 - testaburger (09/22/2014) [-]
There is no debate.

"The will of the Swedish inventor Alfred Nobel established the prizes in 1895."
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nobel_Prize
#75 - beerholder (09/22/2014) [-]
I know how it's spelled, I went to Stockholm last summer and visited the Nobel museum in gamla stan, the guide actually made a joke about how people usually mistake the name.
#66 - That's why we give Noble prizes to scientists and people who f…  [+] (4 new replies) 09/22/2014 on dirty business +11
#70 - testaburger (09/22/2014) [-]
>Noble prizes
#72 - beerholder (09/22/2014) [-]
lol yeah, I have a tendency of calling it Noble instead of Nobel, just like some people call cavalry "calvary"... Richard Feynman received one for physics and he calls it Noble too, so I'm not going to debate spelling.
User avatar #73 - testaburger (09/22/2014) [-]
There is no debate.

"The will of the Swedish inventor Alfred Nobel established the prizes in 1895."
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nobel_Prize
#75 - beerholder (09/22/2014) [-]
I know how it's spelled, I went to Stockholm last summer and visited the Nobel museum in gamla stan, the guide actually made a joke about how people usually mistake the name.
#39 - this is it, thanks! I wish... I wish there was a better way of… 09/20/2014 on how to pick someone up 0
#10 - Working tech support. "Yeah, I have a problem wi… 09/19/2014 on SNSV +5
#12 - I'm sorry for bargin in like this, but can anyone share me tha…  [+] (3 new replies) 09/19/2014 on how to pick someone up +3
#18 - fargfive (09/19/2014) [-]
I really, really wish I hadn't immediately known exactly which gif you were referring to.
#39 - beerholder (09/20/2014) [-]
this is it, thanks! I wish... I wish there was a better way of describing this gif b-but... I can't
#33 - dorfdorfdorf (09/19/2014) [-]
this is a nice thread
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#7 to #6 - beerholder (06/20/2014) [-]
a man of his word...
User avatar #8 to #7 - soundofwinter (06/20/2014) [-]
soundofwinter is a man you can trust
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