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Rank #12426 on CommentsLevel 58 Comments: Sammich eater
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|#3 - this is as good a time as any to say that I think bleach woul… [+] (13 new replies)||05/20/2013 on Description||+6|
#6 - anonexplains (05/20/2013) [-]
bleach is nothing but bullshit now quincy race is near extinction but oh wait thousands of quincies have been in hiding and plan to attack the soul society ichigo starts out as a sub shinigami, now he is a visard, oh wait now he is a fullbring, oh wait even more now he is a quincy......
#7 - srapture (05/20/2013) [-]
This is what anime does. The main character gets fucked up a bit and then become's more powerful that anyone ever!!! Like in Dragonball Z "Holy shit, Goku. I wouldn't go past kaio-ken x3 or something if you wanna not be dead!" "Lololol fuck you kaio-ken x20. DIDN'T EVEN BREAK A SWEAT, FAGGOT!!!". Well, something along those lines.
#18 - snowshark (05/20/2013) [-]
It has already been cited but not in clear enough detail. For the sake of clarity I shall forsake brevity so prepare for a tl;dr.
The Shounen and Shoujo genre are the two most widely recognised genre in animé to the point where many find it near impossible to tell the two apart, however there is much more than immediately meets the eye here. For starters there are the Seinin and Jousei genres. They are for elder readers/watchers focused at the male and female demographics respectively.
Bleach and DBZ suffer the fates of being Shounen Battle series and not particularly spectacular ones at that. DBZ is 10 times better written than bleach but you can argue that Bleach has factors that are 10 times better than certain aspects of DBZ.
At the end of the day though they are very simple and formulaic. Shounen Battle Manga tend to follow a group of characters on some form of journey as they grow stronger and fight tougher enemies. It is satisfying to see the characters grow and struggle against stronger and stronger foes. The big problem with this is that more than likely there comes a point where one or two characters become indescribably stronger than all of the others and the fights can no longer be as simple as they once were.
Most series settle this by having the strong character(s) fight the strong bad guy and the other characters either face off against drastically weaker characters or against nobody at all. Either way, this demeans the other characters in terms of fighting strength and places a negative emphasis on the strength of the main characters.
A good shounen battle series keeps all of the main characters roughly the same strength so that the enemies are all on-par. Either that or they make the strength of the characters very specific meaning that even if they're strong they can't beat everyone.
Most people are fine with this, however. Manga like One Piece have managed to turn the main character(s) into total powerhouses that dwarf the other characters but still give all the other characters enough stuff to do and help out with outside of battles that the audience doesn't mind. It keeps the series diverse rather than having everything be about straight-up fighting.
However, if that still isn't to your taste then I can offer up some far better examples of what manga (and by extension, Anime) can do outside of the simple Shounen Battle Series genre.
The most obvious one, source of your avatar and all, is Death Note. However even though DN is good it isn't alone in its quality. The following series are arguably drastically better than Bleach/DBZ.
Trigun - - Anime is better than the manga.
Cowboy Bebop - - Anime
Battle Angel Alita - - Manga
Battle Anvel Alita: Last Order - - Manga
Kingdom - - Manhua (Chinese Manga)
One Punch Man - - Manga
One Piece - Manga much better than anime
Magi - - Manga much better than anime
Ouran High School Host Club - - Anime and Manga
Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood - - Anime
Sorry for taking so long to explain all this (especially if you already knew) but I feel it is better to take the chance of broadening someone's perspective over the fear of sounding like an old record.
#19 - srapture (05/21/2013) [-]
I'm quite the avid anime watcher so the explanation wasn't necessary, although I can't help appreciating the effort that has gone into it. I just didn't want to be corrected by someone for misusing shounen just in case I didn't quite get the meaning. The only manga I properly read is Naruto, Fairy Tail, and Bleach, simply because I caught up with the anime and wanted to see more. When you say that the One Piece manga is better than the anime, what do you mean by that? I always thought that the anime was just an animated version of the manga (and the addition of hundreds of filler episodes in Naruto), although to my understanding, Fullmetal Alchemist does not follow the manga past episode 15 and Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood does. Not too sure about that though.
#20 - snowshark (05/21/2013) [-]
Well, it is a tricky subject. A lot of people will say the manga is better than the anime in every case. I disagree in most cases and feel both have equal merit, however in certain cases the truth is that the manga is better.
E.G: One Piece. In the Animé, the humour is much more forced and the weirdy noises that people make a lot of the time detracts from the humour. There is simply a little too much going on for the joke to register at the same level. The anime also progresses very slowly so that it doesn't collide with the manga to the point where the first 5 minutes of every episode are filled with an awful lot of pointlessness including an overly-long opening and a recap of what happened last time. This means there's about 19 minutes of actual One Piece content there.
In terms of combat and fighting, a shounen battle anime will usually be much more fun to watch because of the motion, however for everything else the manga serves as a better, less cluttered and faster means to deliver content to the reader. You also get to scrutinise every page and the art is allowed to be better and more detailed as you can spend more time on the single frame. Manga readers often have a far better understanding of the characters and the direction the story is taking than those who simply watch the anime because the anime becomes cluttered with filler (which butchers the pacing) and they don't have time to really get a good look at everything that's going on at once.
Using OP again, the recent direction the manga is taking lent itself to the need to introduce a lot of people in a short space of time. Because still images could be used and focussed upon rather than the need for motion I was able to have a very deep and analytical conversation with a friend of mine discerning the possible outcomes of what is to come ahead. So in that sense manga is superior.
However again, in the favour of anime, filler can sometimes be very good. Fairy Tail's filler arc after the Tenrou arc is the best filler I've ever seen. It expanded upon a deep topic that was sadly briefly glanced over in the manga and stretched it out, pulling potential from it. It reintroduced old characters who had lost their import in the franchise by this point and we got to see character development on their parts. This was also very useful as at least one of those villains has reappeared. It placed him back into out consciousness so we didn't forget him. It was a very good move on the part of the anime.
Bleach has some good filler arcs too. Nice and creative but because they aren't rooted in the actual conflict of the story they are pointless. Naruto on the other hand makes very good use of its filler, expanding upon the characters who get lost in the main story because of the unfortunately massive cast in Naruto. Tenten still does fuck all but it's nice to see what happened to Neji as he became a better person and his relationship to Hinata, for example.
When I say the manga is better, it is because I feel it offers more to the observer than the anime does, however for the best experience, both must be sampled as they offer different experiences.
The example of Trigun is a very good one as the anime is frightfully ambiguous on a number of subjects that the manga is very blunt on. The anime makes fantastic use of the medium with clever shot composition, good use of slapstick and vocal comedy and a great use of motion whereas the manga feels very much like any other manga. The story in the anime is just more engaging due to the small changes and there is more there for you to get when you analyse it because it doesn't out and out say the most interesting things about the series to you, rather it gives you the parts of the equation and asks you to figure out the answer on your own.
Whilst the manga and the anime rarely deviate from the same core plot, the way that the story is experienced can be more or less beneficial to the kind of story that is being told, making the choice between the two less cut and dry than one might originally assume.
(There's also more variety in manga because they're cheaper to make, meaning more risks can be taken with less potential collateral damage to the company/mangaka - the person who illustrates the manga.)
#28 - anonexplains (05/23/2013) [-]
Another example of an anime being better than the manga would be Code Geass. The manga (at least volumes 1,2,4, and 5) completely remove the Knightmare Frames (the mecha in this mecha anime) and drop the tactical battles of R1 (R2 was too rushed to have them, so everything's either OP or chaff)
#21 - srapture (05/21/2013) [-]
You really know a lot about this stuff. I do enjoy lots of fillers, especially in Bleach because there weren't too many of them (the bount arc was pretty shit though). What annoys me about the most recent fillers in Naruto is that they are now introducing new, random characters, showing flashbacks to explain how the main characters already knew them from the past, then defeating them. It's a massive waste of time and it's really starting to get annoying. There is nothing wrong with a filler character being unknown. They don't have to be revealed as being from someone's childhood every single time. Just once, I'd like if they could make it "Oh my god! Who's this?" "I don't know. I guess we'll just have to listen to a bit of an evil rant from him and then battle!". As you said, anime does definitely have the upper-hand in fight scenes. A zoomed out drawing of a huge cloud of fire just doesn't have the same effect as a video of it sweeping over the land. I'll have to read more manga once my A-level exams are over and done with.
#22 - snowshark (05/21/2013) [-]
Hrmm, you'll have plenty of time then. It was after I completed mine I found most of the manga I now consume.
Still, I really enjoyed the Bounto arc. Not because it was good because good is pretty subjective in Bleach, but because Bleach is full of very interesting concepts that Kubo just never explores correctly, the Bounto being one of them. They were more than your typical vampires and they each had really interesting and unique fighting abilities and personalities. Their fights are some of the most interesting in the series to me. I especially liked Baura vs Mayuri.
Bleach is the kind of series where you take what you can get. It is a fantastic series to let your mind wander and think of the 'what if's because the actual truth of what happens is never as satisfying as your own truth. E.G. My favourite character in the series is Karin. Now, imagine for a moment if Karin was suffering from the same symptoms as Ichigo. Subdued hollow and Shinigami powers. It is hinted that they are emerging after Aizen was beaten because of her interactions with Urahara so it leaves a lot to the imagination.
#23 - srapture (05/21/2013) [-]
I love Bleach. It's one of the first anime (anime?..."animes"?... I dunno) I ever watched after Dragonball (+Z). My favourite character is Juushiro Ukitake. He's just so damn loveable. To be honest, I think that my mind has been led into think that the bounto arc was terrible because of my friend who watched it a year after me because I remember enjoying it at the time. Something like:
"I'm at the bount part now. Isn't that bit terrible?"
"It was alright."
"Nah, it didn't really fit with blah blah blah" etc.
I haven't seen it in so long, I though about Mayuri from Steins;Gate when you said her name, and Karin from Naruto.
#24 - snowshark (05/21/2013) [-]
Heh. A lot of stigma exists around the Bounto arc when in truth it has no more bad to it than the rest of the series past the soul society.
But continuing on the train from before. Consider this. What would the story be like if you swapped the positions of just two characters. What would Bleach be like if Toushiro was swapped with Rukia and Karin with Ichigo. I'll not go into my personal thoughts on that or any other interesting mish-mash and let you ponder it a while but give a good think to the way Toushiro would interact with the characters in the real world in contrast to Rukia and how Karin would interact with the spirit world in contrast to Ichigo.
To me it just feels a little less cliché and a little more engaging. It also opens up a lot of other freakishly interesting concepts I won't get into quite yet, mind.
#14 - anonexplains (05/20/2013) [-]
not only that its a shonen i get that the main characters have retard streangth x 10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 ect...
im fine with that but becoming every race ever in the series is just getting old real fast
#12 - anonexplains (05/20/2013) [-]
well in dragon ball z goku doesn't become every race in the series
#4 - neverborn (05/20/2013) [-]
Here we have a villian that damn near the entire series spends building up as a ridiculously powerful and genius badass, then in the final confrontation we see him getting even more powerful, reaching neigh-godlike levels.
At which point the main character spends a wee while in the hyperbolic time-chamber then arrives with his powerlevel so high that even said villain is completely useless against him.
compared to that I'd have rather seen this happen.
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