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#14 - italianchef ONLINE (08/19/2013) [-]
for so many different things ONLY the bad stuff gets hyped, especially by the media. its not that islam is violent or that BS its just so much more common to hear about it
#35 to #14 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
I just LOVE how the media is trying to portray Christianity, Islam, and Judaism as 3 separate things, when they are all the same thing just worded in different ways, with slight changes here and there.

Most of the Muslims I know are very peacefull, respectfull and hate the violence these idiots the media portrays, commits. As you said, it's just becasue the media enjoys putting it's weight on all the bad stuff.
User avatar #21 to #14 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Quran (40:71-72) - When the fetters and the chains shall be on their necks; they shall be dragged Into boiling water, then in the fire shall they be burned

Quran (22:19-21) - But as for those who disbelieve, garments of fire will be cut out for them; boiling fluid will be poured down on their heads; Whereby that which is in their bellies, and their skins too, will be melted; And for them are hooked rods of iron

Quran (4:56) - Those who disbelieve Our revelations, We shall expose them to the Fire. As often as their skins are consumed We shall exchange them for fresh skins that they may taste the torment Lo! Allah is ever Mighty, Wise

Quran (56:92-94) - But if he is of the rejecters, the erring, then the welcome will be boiling water and roasting at hell-fire
Go back to your cave.
User avatar #23 to #21 - alhemicar (08/19/2013) [-]
You do realise this is all about what will happen in hell?
User avatar #26 to #23 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Ma ja ba, 100% kad me oni sjebu.
An Arabic word only has one root. The root word for Islam is “al-Silm,” which means “submission” or “surrender.” There is no disagreement about this among Islamic scholars. al-Silm (submission) does not mean the same thing as al-Salaam (peace), otherwise they would be the same word.

Submission and peace can be very different concepts, even if a form of peace is often brought about through forcing others into submission. As the modern-day Islamic scholar, Ibrahim Sulaiman, puts it, "Jihad is not inhumane, despite its necessary violence and bloodshed, its ultimate desire is peace which is protected and enhanced by the rule of law."

In truth, the Quran not only calls Muslims to submit to Allah, it also commands them to subdue people of other religions until they are in a full state of submission to Islamic rule. This has inspired the aggressive history of Islam and its success in conquering other cultures.
#38 to #26 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
Are you drunk?

If you wern't so filled up with propaganda and extremism you'd acually read about the subject, and understand that Islam is one of the few religions that as let other religions excist within it's territory as long as it does not provoke violence within the community.

Spain, France, even during te CRUSADES. the hight of religious wars, under the rule of Saladin the Wise.
User avatar #40 to #38 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
So lets forget about how Islam came to Europe, but lets focus how they peacefully maintained themsleves in Europe.
#44 to #40 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
Your kind would focus on the great things the Romans built, and ignore the cutlures they butchered, I think it's fair.
User avatar #61 to #44 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Well just look at the Roman Empire and look at Islam.
User avatar #27 to #26 - alhemicar (08/19/2013) [-]
O čemu?

Yes, it means submission to God, that was never disputed. But what does submission to God mean? In one hadith, a bedouin came to Muhammad and asked what he should do to go to heaven, and he replied "Pray 5 times a day, fast during Ramadhan and give zakat".

That what you have just cited further explains it, Jihad is a stuggle for righteousness, I think I don't need to give you an example for that.

And no, it does not, it clearly says in Surat al-Baqarah ayat 256: "There shall be no compulsion in [acceptance of] the religion. The right course has become clear from the wrong!"
#31 to #27 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Brate, zapamti ovo, ja tebe mnogo vise postujem nego tvoje vjerovanje.
User avatar #33 to #31 - alhemicar (08/19/2013) [-]
Poštujem i ja tebe vjeruj mi, ali kad si o tome započeo i ja pođoh. Mada si u pravu što se te slike tiče, ali i naši ne-nacionalisti su u političkom smislu poprilično takvi.
User avatar #37 to #33 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Istina, jebem ja njima svima mater.
#29 to #27 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Yeah, we can see that. Islam is peace. A man serves no man but himself and his fellow brothers. We can see in the muslim world how they are peacefull.
Pasa, ne seri, nemoj uzeti jednu strofu i kazes da je knjiga o miru.
User avatar #32 to #29 - alhemicar (08/19/2013) [-]
Just one thing, Islam =/= Muslims. After Muhammad's death up to probably the 18th century muslims were extremely peaceful, they did conquer other lands, but besides enforcing a tax to non-muslims they were entirelly free. In the Ottoman empire the christians weren't even under the authority of sharia law except their devşirme system, that was gay They became more extremist because they neglected the French englightened ideas from before the revolution, but that don't matter anyway.
Just look at Sarajevo, while 614 mosques were destroyed in Bosnia you can almost count the number of destroyed churches on your hands.
Ali de mi reci, jesi li to pročitao cijeli Kur'an pa tako stručno znaš?
#41 to #32 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
Don't waste your time on people who are to stuck in their narrow minded ways of life. It's not worth it, especially when it's FJ.    
Here, have a fox for your trouble.
Don't waste your time on people who are to stuck in their narrow minded ways of life. It's not worth it, especially when it's FJ.

Here, have a fox for your trouble.
#46 to #41 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Yeah right.
#58 to #46 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
I should follow my own advice and not waste my time on you. See you around.
I should follow my own advice and not waste my time on you. See you around.
User avatar #62 to #58 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
The Quran:
Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief] is worse than killing...
but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)" The historical context of this passage is not defensive warfare, since Muhammad and his Muslims had just relocated to Medina and were not under attack by their Meccan adversaries. In fact, the verses urge offensive warfare, in that Muslims are to drive Meccans out of their own city (which they later did). The use of the word "persecution" by some Muslim translators is thus disingenuous (the actual Muslim words for persecution - "idtihad" - and oppression - a variation of "z-l-m" - do not appear in the verse). The actual Arabic comes from "fitna" which can mean disbelief, or the disorder that results from unbelief or temptation. Taken as a whole, the context makes clear that violence is being authorized until "religion is for Allah" - ie. unbelievers desist in their unbelief.
Another one bites the dust.
You leave now, because you have no good arguments against me.
#63 to #62 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
Look m8, I said I am done, so see you around.
#64 to #63 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
See you around traitor.
#55 to #46 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
You're good at googling stuff. I bet you I can find violant kinder garteners, hand it to the media, and they will probably make the world believe children are gonna take over the world. Or at least people like you.

All religions, ideologies and such have their extremists. The Media focuses on them, and ignores the rest.
User avatar #65 to #55 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
The thing is, Islam is extreme.
#66 to #65 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
Wait, you're still here? Still sending me stuff? Desperate to prove our point, arn't we ^^
Wait, you're still here? Still sending me stuff? Desperate to prove our point, arn't we ^^
#69 to #66 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Desperate times call for desperate measure. You and people like you are the reason mankind became like this.
#72 to #69 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
Meh.. one last comment then: So... the fall of the Roman Empire didn't lead to what we know as Modern Europe? For your side just so you can understand the importance of different cultures: The Fall of the Roman Empire didn't lead to the Nazi reign? It didn't lead to a strong and independent collection of states which is now the "Western World". Islam didn't lead us foward in mathematics, astronomy, architecture, infrastructure, economy, and agriculture when Europe was at it's lowest?
With that help from another culture at it's hight, we didn't reach grow as a society through the 15-1900 and til today through trade, exchanging of ideas, and last but not least, rivalry?

Good day.
User avatar #77 to #72 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
And yeah you are right, I should no waste time talking to stupid people.
User avatar #73 to #72 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Although there is no arguing that the Muslim world was relatively more advanced during this period than the “Christian” world, the reasons for this have absolutely nothing to do with the Islamic religion (other than its mandate for military expansion). In fact, the religion tends to discourages knowledge outside of itself, which is why the most prolific Muslim scholars are usually students of religion rather than science.

[Note that the country of Spain alone translates more learning material and literature into Spanish each year than the entire Arab world has translated into Arabic since the 9th century. As the Saudi Grand Mufti bluntly put it in 2010, "The Quran with its stories and knowledge are sufficient for us... we don't need the Torah, or Gospels, or any other book].

The many fundamentalists and other devotees who dress as Muhammad did and adopt 7th century lifestyles to some degree or another underscore the importance of tradition in Islam. The religion is highly conservative and resistant to change, which is viewed with suspicion. As scholar Bernard Lewis points out, in Islam an innovation is presumed to be bad unless it can be proven to be good.

Beyond this, there are four basic reasons why Islam has little true claim to scientific achievement:

First, the Muslim world benefited greatly from the Greek sciences, which were translated for them by Christians and Jews. To their credit, Muslims did a better job of preserving Greek text than did the Europeans of the time, and this became the foundation for their own knowledge. (One large reason for this, however, was that access by Christians to this part of their world was cut off by Muslim slave ships and coastal raids that dominated the Mediterranean during this period).
#76 to #73 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
HAhah xD You're unbeliveable. You cut that right from the internet (a lot of it). Haha, take care m8.

(User has now logged of and can not take the recieving user seriously, and will therefore not answer any comments no matter how dimwitted or funny.)
#89 to #76 - anon (08/19/2013) [-]
Have you tried, you know, actually presenting a thoughtful argument backed up by facts? Or does calling everybody who disagrees with you an ignorant moron satisfy your requirements for winning an argument? How fcuking old are you?
#96 to #89 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
Oh, and if he allowed to be racist, giving people less worth based on stereotypes, then why can't I?
#98 to #96 - anon (08/19/2013) [-]
How in the hell is the poster racist? God damn you're fcuking stupid. Somebody criticises a religion/race/culture and immediately idiots like yourself come running and calling the race card. FYI criticising a belief system is not racist, but this goes to show how much you know.

Seriously, start using some real arguments and facts before speaking.
#100 to #98 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
And I'll come with real arguments when I am not poking fun, not discussing stuff over the internet, especially on a "fun site", and could actually be bothered.
#99 to #98 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
Oh sorry my butthurt friend, I ment "Discrimination".
Oh sorry my butthurt friend, I ment "Discrimination".
#95 to #89 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
I have. Read and you will see it ^^
User avatar #78 to #76 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Can you atleast read it. Or do you have a room temperature IQ.
User avatar #74 to #73 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Secondly, many of the scientific advances credited to Islam were actually “borrowed” from other cultures conquered by the Muslims. The algebraic concept of “zero”, for example, is erroneously attributed to Islam when, in fact, it was a Hindu discovery that was merely introduced to the West by Muslims.

In truth, conquered populations contributed greatly to the history of “Muslim science” until gradually being decimated by conversion to Islam (under the pressures of dhimmitude). The Muslim concentration within a population is proportional to the decline of scientific achievement. It is no accident that the Muslim world has had little to show for itself in the last 800 years or so, since running out of new civilizations to cannibalize.

Third, even accomplished Muslim scientists and cultural icons were often considered heretics in their day, sometimes with good reason. One of the greatest achievers to come out of the Muslim world was the Persian scientist and philosopher, al-Razi. His impressive works are often held up today as “proof” of Muslim accomplishment. But what the apologists often leave out is that al-Razi was denounced as a blasphemer, since he followed his own religious beliefs – which were in obvious contradiction to traditional Islam.

Fourth, even the contributions that are attributed to Islam (often inaccurately) are not terribly dramatic. There is the invention of certain words, such as alchemy and elixir (and assassin, by the way), but not much else that survives in modern technology which is of practical significance. Neither is there any reason to believe that such discoveries would not have easily been made by the West following the cultural awakening triggered by the Reformation.
User avatar #75 to #74 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
As an example, consider that Muslims claim credit for "inventing" coffee - in the sense that they popularized an existing discovery by Africans who were caught up in the Arab slave trade. However, it is also true that the red dye used in many food products, from cranberry juice to candy, comes from the abdomen of a particular female beetle found in South America. It is extremely unlikely that the West would not have stumbled across coffee by now (although, to be fair, coffee probably expedited subsequent discoveries).

In fact, the litany of “Muslim” achievement often takes the form of rhapsody, in which the true origins of these discoveries are omitted - along with their comparative significance to Western achievement. One often doesn't hear about the dismal fate of original accomplishments either. Those who brag about the great observatory of Taqi al-Din in [freshly conquered] Istanbul, for example, often neglect to mention that it was quickly destroyed by the caliphate.

At the end of the day, the record of scientific, medical and technological accomplishment is not something over which Muslim apologists want to get into a contest with the Christian world. Today’s Islamic innovators are primarily known for turning Western technology, such as cell phones and airplanes, into instruments of mass murder.

To sum up, although the Islamic religion is not entirely hostile to science, neither should it be confused as a facilitator. The great achievements that are said to have come out of the Islamic world were made either by non-Muslims who happened to be under Islamic rule, or by heretics who usually had little interest in Islam. Scientific discovery tapers off dramatically as Islam asserts dominance, until it eventually peters out altogether.
#97 to #75 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
Schnizel, I was not being very... what is it called... professional? Honestly, I was just poking fun. Anyway, I am sorry about that. On the other hand, at least you voice your opinion through a visible account.. compared to 90% of the people who agree with you who spam as Anonymus.    
I might not agree with you, you've got different ideas, but at least you seem to have a head on your shoulders.
Schnizel, I was not being very... what is it called... professional? Honestly, I was just poking fun. Anyway, I am sorry about that. On the other hand, at least you voice your opinion through a visible account.. compared to 90% of the people who agree with you who spam as Anonymus.

I might not agree with you, you've got different ideas, but at least you seem to have a head on your shoulders.
User avatar #109 to #97 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
#86 to #75 - anon (08/19/2013) [-]
Mate, don't bother, you're just arguing with a blind, ignorant moron. Most probably a liberal leftard.
#67 to #66 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
Yay, I can use my fox gifs or no apparent reason.
User avatar #45 to #41 - alhemicar (08/19/2013) [-]
Nah, it's just I know this guy, we're from the same city so it makes it a little awkward.
But thanks for the fox c:
#50 to #45 - Bloodgartham (08/19/2013) [-]
You actually know him? That's nice.

Take care.
User avatar #48 to #45 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
I still luv y no homo
User avatar #49 to #48 - alhemicar (08/19/2013) [-]
same here a little homo c:
User avatar #52 to #49 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Only 0,000000000000000001%
User avatar #57 to #52 - alhemicar (08/19/2013) [-]
hah jes
User avatar #34 to #32 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Da ako te interesuje, jesam.
Ajmo se vratiti malo prije, od pocetka islama, i kako se sirio. I sta je radio.
#112 to #34 - sirio (08/20/2013) [-]
what about me?
User avatar #114 to #112 - schnizel (08/20/2013) [-]
What about you.
#115 to #114 - sirio (08/20/2013) [-]
Idk i got a message that you mentioned me.
User avatar #116 to #115 - schnizel (08/20/2013) [-]
Ok, širio means spread in our language.
#117 to #116 - sirio (08/20/2013) [-]
omg seriously? i just thought of a random word to be completely honest.
User avatar #36 to #34 - alhemicar (08/19/2013) [-]
Hajde onda, da čujemo.
User avatar #39 to #36 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Eh da pricamo o totalitarnoj religiji u kojoj nesmijes nista reci protiv nje, ako kazes ubiju te, seru nesto o miru dok ubijaju zene ako se ne mogu dogovoriti ko ce je uzeti.... Hoces da nastavim.
User avatar #42 to #39 - alhemicar (08/19/2013) [-]
Gledaj, pretresi ovog tipa nikad nisu ništa uspjeli, ako ćemo ovako onda bih radije sačuvao svoje vrijeme, pogotovu ako ćemo se samo svađati. I osim toga, popizdit će ovi Englezi.

Odoh ja onda uzet koje pivo, bolje mi je za odmorit.
User avatar #43 to #42 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Haj vidimo se. Pozdravi Hasu.
User avatar #47 to #43 - alhemicar (08/19/2013) [-]
Haha, hoću, mada mi je draži Željo.
User avatar #51 to #47 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Hehe, I ja bi navijo za zelju ali jebo mater nema veze kad neidemo nigdje.
User avatar #53 to #51 - alhemicar (08/19/2013) [-]
A jest jebu, ali biće nekad
User avatar #56 to #53 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Ono, bit ce para, ali ih nece biti.
User avatar #59 to #56 - alhemicar (08/19/2013) [-]
Pa eto, nisu samo pare bitne, ali hajde, čujemo se.
User avatar #60 to #59 - schnizel (08/19/2013) [-]
Aj vidimo se.
User avatar #54 to #53 - alhemicar (08/19/2013) [-]
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